1 00:00:03,169 --> 00:00:02,450 and it hits me oh my gosh this is that 2 00:00:04,309 --> 00:00:03,179 triangle 3 00:00:05,420 --> 00:00:04,319 you know there's explanation for 4 00:00:07,789 --> 00:00:05,430 everything that occurred in the 5 00:00:10,129 --> 00:00:07,799 Rendlesham forest incident it involved 6 00:00:13,660 --> 00:00:10,139 aliens at all it was completely silent 7 00:00:16,550 --> 00:00:13,670 it comes right over our head it's so a 8 00:00:18,320 --> 00:00:16,560 classic flying-saucer really stunningly 9 00:00:20,060 --> 00:00:18,330 McCleary he turned over to my father 10 00:00:25,880 --> 00:00:20,070 held his hand and he looked in his eyes 11 00:00:28,490 --> 00:00:25,890 and said we're not alone welcome to 12 00:00:30,890 --> 00:00:28,500 podcast UFO for our live show 13 00:00:33,080 --> 00:00:30,900 we're live every Wednesday at 8 p.m. 14 00:00:35,600 --> 00:00:33,090 Eastern Standard Time on the dark matter 15 00:00:39,290 --> 00:00:35,610 radio network please remember to visit 16 00:00:42,470 --> 00:00:39,300 the website podcast UFO comm for past 17 00:00:44,479 --> 00:00:42,480 episodes blogs and forums during the 18 00:00:46,970 --> 00:00:44,489 show feel free to participate live in 19 00:00:49,540 --> 00:00:46,980 our chat room and don't forget to Like 20 00:00:52,189 --> 00:00:49,550 us on our very active Facebook page 21 00:00:54,410 --> 00:00:52,199 hello and welcome to the show on Martin 22 00:00:57,470 --> 00:00:54,420 Willis your host and I'm glad to be back 23 00:01:00,470 --> 00:00:57,480 yes I'm back a little jet-lagged but I 24 00:01:02,240 --> 00:01:00,480 am here tonight's guests we have a great 25 00:01:05,270 --> 00:01:02,250 guest tonight interesting been wanting 26 00:01:08,870 --> 00:01:05,280 him on for a long time it's dr. John 27 00:01:11,270 --> 00:01:08,880 Alexander retired Army colonel a real 28 00:01:13,330 --> 00:01:11,280 interesting guy quite a background we'll 29 00:01:15,920 --> 00:01:13,340 be talking him in a little bit here 30 00:01:18,859 --> 00:01:15,930 before that we have Alejandro Rojas 31 00:01:20,690 --> 00:01:18,869 coming up with the news and now I'd like 32 00:01:23,480 --> 00:01:20,700 to tell you a little bit about what's 33 00:01:26,120 --> 00:01:23,490 going on this is the last day that 34 00:01:28,850 --> 00:01:26,130 Joyride is going to have their platform 35 00:01:31,760 --> 00:01:28,860 up they're going down this evening in 36 00:01:35,090 --> 00:01:31,770 just a couple of hours and so they're 37 00:01:37,340 --> 00:01:35,100 gone well it is really a blessing 38 00:01:39,740 --> 00:01:37,350 disguise if you ask me because now we 39 00:01:41,870 --> 00:01:39,750 have the whole program right on our 40 00:01:44,359 --> 00:01:41,880 website so the second part of the show 41 00:01:46,550 --> 00:01:44,369 will be available to support us and you 42 00:01:52,399 --> 00:01:46,560 can support the show for only a dollar 43 00:01:58,910 --> 00:01:52,409 or more per month and we have a $1 of $2 44 00:02:00,859 --> 00:01:58,920 $5 $10 and $25 subscription now the mp3s 45 00:02:04,060 --> 00:02:00,869 can be played on our website and 46 00:02:07,760 --> 00:02:04,070 downloaded we also have an RSS feed link 47 00:02:10,219 --> 00:02:07,770 that can go into almost any podcast 48 00:02:12,740 --> 00:02:10,229 application including iTunes your iPhone 49 00:02:13,339 --> 00:02:12,750 and all kinds of apps that you can get 50 00:02:20,509 --> 00:02:13,349 on 51 00:02:23,270 --> 00:02:20,519 who helped you know with that he 52 00:02:25,280 --> 00:02:23,280 basically set us up everything is 53 00:02:26,449 --> 00:02:25,290 working really well there's a couple of 54 00:02:28,789 --> 00:02:26,459 issues but I think we're getting them 55 00:02:30,080 --> 00:02:28,799 all worked out the buck stops here if 56 00:02:33,110 --> 00:02:30,090 there's any problems at all you're going 57 00:02:35,390 --> 00:02:33,120 to be emailing me at Martin at podcast 58 00:02:39,229 --> 00:02:35,400 UFO comm you go right on our website and 59 00:02:42,140 --> 00:02:39,239 you can see on the menu bar support us 60 00:02:45,289 --> 00:02:42,150 and sign up and you log in on our 61 00:02:47,330 --> 00:02:45,299 website I think it's great it's a really 62 00:02:49,610 --> 00:02:47,340 nice system and I appreciate your 63 00:02:51,050 --> 00:02:49,620 support any support you can give will 64 00:02:53,750 --> 00:02:51,060 help out we've added a couple more 65 00:02:55,789 --> 00:02:53,760 expenses with that we're getting some 66 00:02:57,229 --> 00:02:55,799 great guests coming up the skeptic 67 00:02:59,839 --> 00:02:57,239 Michael Shermer is coming up we have 68 00:03:02,479 --> 00:02:59,849 James Fox on a lot of other really great 69 00:03:04,399 --> 00:03:02,489 guests coming up so we're getting a lot 70 00:03:08,209 --> 00:03:04,409 of help with like I said with a new 71 00:03:11,390 --> 00:03:08,219 staff person helping with that and one 72 00:03:13,909 --> 00:03:11,400 thing I am going to shout out and one 73 00:03:15,649 --> 00:03:13,919 thing I'm going to ask for out theirs if 74 00:03:17,569 --> 00:03:15,659 anyone's a graphic designer 75 00:03:19,789 --> 00:03:17,579 the person that was going to be doing my 76 00:03:22,309 --> 00:03:19,799 t-shirts is kind of bowed out on me 77 00:03:23,780 --> 00:03:22,319 in New York City he keeps saying you 78 00:03:26,449 --> 00:03:23,790 know next week next week and it never 79 00:03:28,339 --> 00:03:26,459 happens so I need t-shirt graphics I 80 00:03:30,409 --> 00:03:28,349 also would like to have a banner graphic 81 00:03:32,449 --> 00:03:30,419 for my website I'm not real happy with 82 00:03:33,920 --> 00:03:32,459 what's up there now so if there's anyone 83 00:03:35,990 --> 00:03:33,930 out there that would like to do that 84 00:03:41,569 --> 00:03:36,000 type of work please contact me at Martin 85 00:03:44,210 --> 00:03:41,579 at podcast UFO comm also if someone 86 00:03:45,800 --> 00:03:44,220 wants to write a blog I am accepting 87 00:03:48,830 --> 00:03:45,810 guest blogs I never really talked about 88 00:03:51,080 --> 00:03:48,840 that but I do accept guest blogs and I 89 00:03:52,189 --> 00:03:51,090 guess that's enough chatting for a while 90 00:03:56,860 --> 00:03:52,199 so the first hour are going to be 91 00:03:59,270 --> 00:03:56,870 talking to John Alexander about his pass 92 00:04:00,530 --> 00:03:59,280 all the different things he's done and 93 00:04:02,990 --> 00:04:00,540 in the second hour we're going to be 94 00:04:04,520 --> 00:04:03,000 talking about the skinwalker ranch he 95 00:04:07,879 --> 00:04:04,530 was one of the researchers there and 96 00:04:10,069 --> 00:04:07,889 that to me is a fascinating place 97 00:04:11,899 --> 00:04:10,079 very eerie a lot of stuff going on there 98 00:04:14,629 --> 00:04:11,909 so right now we're going to be bringing 99 00:04:17,270 --> 00:04:14,639 in Alejandro Rojas for the news how are 100 00:04:20,719 --> 00:04:17,280 you Alejandro I'm doing all right how 101 00:04:25,700 --> 00:04:20,729 you doing good good good to be back in 102 00:04:27,020 --> 00:04:25,710 the US of A yeah huh yeah I you know it 103 00:04:29,150 --> 00:04:27,030 took 26 hours 104 00:04:33,140 --> 00:04:29,160 to get home and I'm still I just got 105 00:04:34,460 --> 00:04:33,150 home hours ago and so the time right now 106 00:04:37,610 --> 00:04:34,470 I was like three o'clock in the morning 107 00:04:40,700 --> 00:04:37,620 for me mm-hmm you know in this show yeah 108 00:04:42,860 --> 00:04:40,710 yeah so it's uh I'm going to try to do a 109 00:04:44,930 --> 00:04:42,870 good job how did you have fun I know 110 00:04:46,640 --> 00:04:44,940 there was this harrowing experience with 111 00:04:49,760 --> 00:04:46,650 this old lady who wanted to push you off 112 00:04:51,860 --> 00:04:49,770 of a cliff yeah she just heard American 113 00:04:54,800 --> 00:04:51,870 yes they hated Americans there was a lot 114 00:04:56,390 --> 00:04:54,810 of people I noticed walking a very busy 115 00:04:58,250 --> 00:04:56,400 area on the Black Sea where I was 116 00:05:00,050 --> 00:04:58,260 walking along the I guess like a 117 00:05:03,860 --> 00:05:00,060 boardwalk type of thing with lots and 118 00:05:06,380 --> 00:05:03,870 lots of people a beautiful area but if I 119 00:05:07,880 --> 00:05:06,390 was talking I would get the stink-eye 120 00:05:10,970 --> 00:05:07,890 people would turn around look at me like 121 00:05:12,980 --> 00:05:10,980 real angry when they heard an American 122 00:05:14,750 --> 00:05:12,990 because it's not really there's not a 123 00:05:18,409 --> 00:05:14,760 lot of American tourists in the area I 124 00:05:20,540 --> 00:05:18,419 was in South Russia and it was extremely 125 00:05:22,730 --> 00:05:20,550 I was almost Arizona hut there it was in 126 00:05:25,159 --> 00:05:22,740 the 90s near 100 most of the time I was 127 00:05:28,250 --> 00:05:25,169 there yeah but I'll tell you I had a lot 128 00:05:31,100 --> 00:05:28,260 of near-death experiences driving real 129 00:05:34,010 --> 00:05:31,110 oh yeah if you're it's pretty crazy you 130 00:05:37,100 --> 00:05:34,020 know in Sullivan square they have you 131 00:05:38,210 --> 00:05:37,110 see all the dash cams and that meteor 132 00:05:40,460 --> 00:05:38,220 going over well there's a reason 133 00:05:41,900 --> 00:05:40,470 everyone has a dash cam is they want to 134 00:05:44,630 --> 00:05:41,910 know who they're going to have a head-on 135 00:05:46,460 --> 00:05:44,640 collision with yeah well I guess it is 136 00:05:48,290 --> 00:05:46,470 for insurance purposes because people 137 00:05:52,070 --> 00:05:48,300 drive so crazy that they can prove their 138 00:05:54,080 --> 00:05:52,080 case what insurance they about allegedly 139 00:05:57,830 --> 00:05:54,090 that's why they have dashcam so much out 140 00:06:00,469 --> 00:05:57,840 there oh yeah there's a dashcam UFO 141 00:06:03,230 --> 00:06:00,479 story going on right now oh really do 142 00:06:06,080 --> 00:06:03,240 you have information on NASA yeah I mean 143 00:06:08,690 --> 00:06:06,090 I didn't really pay at Munch attention 144 00:06:10,370 --> 00:06:08,700 because I you know the consensus even 145 00:06:13,010 --> 00:06:10,380 with the online people is that it's a 146 00:06:15,020 --> 00:06:13,020 bird but of course it says crazy UK 147 00:06:18,170 --> 00:06:15,030 tabloids that are pushing the story of 148 00:06:20,510 --> 00:06:18,180 UFO may have caused a crash and a fatal 149 00:06:22,909 --> 00:06:20,520 crash and you know there's a car driving 150 00:06:25,040 --> 00:06:22,919 along in Russia and you see a truck and 151 00:06:29,360 --> 00:06:25,050 it looks like a car mr. beard in the 152 00:06:31,150 --> 00:06:29,370 wrong lane got hit that should look that 153 00:06:34,130 --> 00:06:31,160 bad but I guess someone died from it but 154 00:06:35,570 --> 00:06:34,140 before the accident happens there's 155 00:06:37,550 --> 00:06:35,580 something that comes across this guy at 156 00:06:40,490 --> 00:06:37,560 the top of the screen and it does look 157 00:06:44,060 --> 00:06:40,500 like a bird but you know people got 158 00:06:45,920 --> 00:06:44,070 sensationalize you know I was up dropped 159 00:06:48,380 --> 00:06:45,930 at the airport like I said it was twenty 160 00:06:50,240 --> 00:06:48,390 six hours of by the time you land in 161 00:06:52,790 --> 00:06:50,250 Moscow and then go to the towns in South 162 00:06:56,030 --> 00:06:52,800 Russia where I went got off all that 163 00:06:59,630 --> 00:06:56,040 traveling got into the car and five 164 00:07:02,570 --> 00:06:59,640 minutes later going on a bridge to Lane 165 00:07:04,820 --> 00:07:02,580 bridge there's a car coming right at us 166 00:07:05,360 --> 00:07:04,830 head-on I wasn't even in the car five 167 00:07:09,380 --> 00:07:05,370 minutes 168 00:07:11,720 --> 00:07:09,390 Wow and the driver which was my 169 00:07:14,810 --> 00:07:11,730 girlfriend's father snugged at right 170 00:07:17,659 --> 00:07:14,820 almost under a semi so we wouldn't get 171 00:07:20,540 --> 00:07:17,669 hit and I'm not on you kidding no oh it 172 00:07:23,420 --> 00:07:20,550 was like thank God by inches and I and 173 00:07:25,040 --> 00:07:23,430 he's not wearing a seat belt and uh you 174 00:07:27,920 --> 00:07:25,050 know we I mean he unhooked his seatbelt 175 00:07:29,630 --> 00:07:27,930 just before that and I said to my 176 00:07:30,890 --> 00:07:29,640 girlfriend what's going on you know and 177 00:07:35,330 --> 00:07:30,900 and she's oh yeah he doesn't wear a 178 00:07:37,040 --> 00:07:35,340 seatbelt yeah and I saw some one more 179 00:07:39,560 --> 00:07:37,050 thing I got to say is uh I saw some 180 00:07:40,790 --> 00:07:39,570 corruption firsthand there really oh 181 00:07:42,860 --> 00:07:40,800 yeah tell me about it 182 00:07:44,960 --> 00:07:42,870 please corrupt was it button oh okay 183 00:07:48,020 --> 00:07:44,970 yeah no they they pull you over for 184 00:07:49,610 --> 00:07:48,030 absolutely no reason at all and they 185 00:07:52,030 --> 00:07:49,620 take your license they hold her in the 186 00:07:55,610 --> 00:07:52,040 hand if you want it back you have to pay 187 00:07:58,210 --> 00:07:55,620 650 rubles which is a hundred bucks and 188 00:08:02,360 --> 00:07:58,220 it's I'm not joking I'm not exaggerating 189 00:08:05,420 --> 00:08:02,370 so I saw that also getting our pet into 190 00:08:07,280 --> 00:08:05,430 the country at Moscow we had to slip a 191 00:08:10,640 --> 00:08:07,290 little cash to the veterinarian there 192 00:08:12,530 --> 00:08:10,650 geez you know on and on it's a lot like 193 00:08:15,110 --> 00:08:12,540 that you know and it's just it's it's 194 00:08:18,290 --> 00:08:15,120 the way things are done you have to if 195 00:08:19,790 --> 00:08:18,300 you want to survive you can't go down to 196 00:08:21,230 --> 00:08:19,800 the police department and complain 197 00:08:23,480 --> 00:08:21,240 either because the chief police is 198 00:08:26,480 --> 00:08:23,490 getting you know his percentage from the 199 00:08:28,400 --> 00:08:26,490 people out there so it's that is so sad 200 00:08:29,960 --> 00:08:28,410 you know there are a lot of South 201 00:08:32,240 --> 00:08:29,970 American countries including Mexico 202 00:08:34,040 --> 00:08:32,250 that's like that yeah it's like every 203 00:08:36,230 --> 00:08:34,050 month you owe your boss if you're a 204 00:08:38,240 --> 00:08:36,240 police officer or other government 205 00:08:40,100 --> 00:08:38,250 officials you owe your boss a certain 206 00:08:42,430 --> 00:08:40,110 amount of money and you owe your boss 207 00:08:45,290 --> 00:08:42,440 more money and you here especially in 208 00:08:47,150 --> 00:08:45,300 South American countries where you know 209 00:08:49,190 --> 00:08:47,160 anything if you want anything to get 210 00:08:51,530 --> 00:08:49,200 done it costs big bucks and there's some 211 00:08:53,240 --> 00:08:51,540 things if you're not rich just don't 212 00:08:54,240 --> 00:08:53,250 even bother you know getting a license 213 00:08:57,059 --> 00:08:54,250 for your car what 214 00:08:59,490 --> 00:08:57,069 because they're preoccupied and you know 215 00:09:01,769 --> 00:08:59,500 the rich people go in the queue that 216 00:09:04,019 --> 00:09:01,779 give them money it's so sad that 217 00:09:06,059 --> 00:09:04,029 corruption that's exactly the way it is 218 00:09:09,150 --> 00:09:06,069 there I found that you know they're 219 00:09:11,550 --> 00:09:09,160 looking down at us right oh yeah they 220 00:09:13,139 --> 00:09:11,560 that's right but anyway it was a 221 00:09:15,809 --> 00:09:13,149 complaint hearing and they don't 222 00:09:17,699 --> 00:09:15,819 understand corruption no absolutely and 223 00:09:20,129 --> 00:09:17,709 I'll tell you it feels really good to 224 00:09:22,110 --> 00:09:20,139 get back you know really feels good feel 225 00:09:23,970 --> 00:09:22,120 safe here I feel so yeah well when the 226 00:09:26,490 --> 00:09:23,980 old ladies want to push you off a cliff 227 00:09:29,670 --> 00:09:26,500 that's right I told that story on your 228 00:09:31,650 --> 00:09:29,680 show but yeah meeting this group of 229 00:09:32,970 --> 00:09:31,660 people with dogs you know my dog was 230 00:09:35,759 --> 00:09:32,980 playing with their dog and stuff like 231 00:09:40,019 --> 00:09:35,769 that I don't speak any Russian and this 232 00:09:42,449 --> 00:09:40,029 woman was very very upset that I was 233 00:09:45,030 --> 00:09:42,459 there and when I walked away and took a 234 00:09:47,249 --> 00:09:45,040 picture of everyone in a group she was 235 00:09:49,019 --> 00:09:47,259 dead serious she wanted to push me off 236 00:09:52,499 --> 00:09:49,029 the cliff and wanted to kill me 237 00:09:55,619 --> 00:09:52,509 and every time she they ran into each 238 00:09:57,749 --> 00:09:55,629 other a bunch of times and you know 239 00:10:01,530 --> 00:09:57,759 every single time she said I really 240 00:10:04,759 --> 00:10:01,540 would love to kill him wow that is 241 00:10:07,319 --> 00:10:04,769 really wild and you know we don't I 242 00:10:09,629 --> 00:10:07,329 haven't met a Russian here in the States 243 00:10:11,280 --> 00:10:09,639 even the ones with accent in New York 244 00:10:13,199 --> 00:10:11,290 there's a lot of Russians or sometimes 245 00:10:14,610 --> 00:10:13,209 when you go and there's tourists and 246 00:10:17,040 --> 00:10:14,620 they don't even speak English in 247 00:10:21,629 --> 00:10:17,050 Colorado there is actually quite a few 248 00:10:23,129 --> 00:10:21,639 and bad you know I don't want to hurt 249 00:10:25,499 --> 00:10:23,139 him or kill him some of them are a lot 250 00:10:27,780 --> 00:10:25,509 of fun to hang out with oh I I really 251 00:10:30,240 --> 00:10:27,790 enjoy I enjoy the culture although as 252 00:10:32,189 --> 00:10:30,250 funny as you know in Colorado I had I 253 00:10:34,499 --> 00:10:32,199 lived in an apartment complex years ago 254 00:10:35,759 --> 00:10:34,509 and there were some Russian Russians 255 00:10:37,829 --> 00:10:35,769 that lived in it it was kind of a 256 00:10:40,470 --> 00:10:37,839 neighborhood were there Russians and my 257 00:10:42,720 --> 00:10:40,480 thought was as got least when it came to 258 00:10:45,350 --> 00:10:42,730 the girls how do I try to date one of 259 00:10:48,299 --> 00:10:45,360 these girls that doesn't speak English 260 00:10:51,569 --> 00:10:48,309 but certainly I didn't want to kill any 261 00:10:53,939 --> 00:10:51,579 of them yeah yeah absolutely well it's 262 00:10:56,790 --> 00:10:53,949 sort of a bipolar situation it was like 263 00:10:59,190 --> 00:10:56,800 oh you're an American Oh 264 00:11:01,800 --> 00:10:59,200 Wow you know I mean there was that too 265 00:11:04,680 --> 00:11:01,810 oh good so there were some people who 266 00:11:07,320 --> 00:11:04,690 wanted to yes who were very happy and 267 00:11:08,699 --> 00:11:07,330 and spoken melodies they they said all I 268 00:11:10,320 --> 00:11:08,709 want to go to America I want to live to 269 00:11:10,949 --> 00:11:10,330 America this one woman wanted me to 270 00:11:15,420 --> 00:11:10,959 marry her 271 00:11:16,920 --> 00:11:15,430 Wow yeah so I wish I was joking 272 00:11:20,400 --> 00:11:16,930 so did your girlfriend get in a fight 273 00:11:24,990 --> 00:11:20,410 with her no she she basically said go 274 00:11:29,130 --> 00:11:25,000 right ahead ha ha ha ha so anyway it's 275 00:11:32,610 --> 00:11:29,140 good to be back and in one piece and 276 00:11:35,880 --> 00:11:32,620 yeah but anyway that's going on with the 277 00:11:37,470 --> 00:11:35,890 UFO news this week UFO news I guess we 278 00:11:39,690 --> 00:11:37,480 ought to get to that yeah some 279 00:11:42,060 --> 00:11:39,700 interesting things a few interesting 280 00:11:43,500 --> 00:11:42,070 videos and actually you know all the 281 00:11:44,069 --> 00:11:43,510 stories I'm going to be doing is Roger 282 00:11:47,250 --> 00:11:44,079 Marsh 283 00:11:50,069 --> 00:11:47,260 at because I've gotten so busy with 284 00:11:52,259 --> 00:11:50,079 MUFON and with the Congress has got a 285 00:11:54,240 --> 00:11:52,269 lot of going on with that our UFO 286 00:11:56,910 --> 00:11:54,250 Congress which is in February however 287 00:11:58,860 --> 00:11:56,920 the and I should can tell people right 288 00:12:01,199 --> 00:11:58,870 now today is the last day to get the 289 00:12:04,310 --> 00:12:01,209 super early bird special so you get a 290 00:12:06,870 --> 00:12:04,320 huge discount if you go register today 291 00:12:09,630 --> 00:12:06,880 for the UFO Congress and the speaker's 292 00:12:11,610 --> 00:12:09,640 list is awesome but that's been a lot of 293 00:12:14,760 --> 00:12:11,620 work but Rogers been posting some really 294 00:12:16,530 --> 00:12:14,770 good stuff I challenged him to you know 295 00:12:18,720 --> 00:12:16,540 go through those MUFON files and look 296 00:12:20,850 --> 00:12:18,730 for some good videos and I think he's 297 00:12:22,920 --> 00:12:20,860 found some good stuff however this first 298 00:12:25,650 --> 00:12:22,930 one I want to talk to you about is not a 299 00:12:28,350 --> 00:12:25,660 UFO video however it's interesting 300 00:12:31,380 --> 00:12:28,360 because it's this elaborate kind of 301 00:12:33,720 --> 00:12:31,390 drawing that this witness had made of 302 00:12:36,810 --> 00:12:33,730 what she and her boyfriend believed they 303 00:12:39,510 --> 00:12:36,820 had seen at about 11:00 p.m. at night a 304 00:12:41,850 --> 00:12:39,520 large triangular craft with red and blue 305 00:12:45,090 --> 00:12:41,860 lights below it you know white lights 306 00:12:48,210 --> 00:12:45,100 had ran along the rim of two sides of 307 00:12:51,480 --> 00:12:48,220 this triangle and what's interesting is 308 00:12:54,030 --> 00:12:51,490 that they saw this in Livermore 309 00:12:56,939 --> 00:12:54,040 California which of course is the home 310 00:12:59,610 --> 00:12:56,949 of the famous Livermore Lawrence 311 00:13:01,350 --> 00:12:59,620 Livermore National Laboratory which is 312 00:13:03,329 --> 00:13:01,360 kind of where they do a lot of 313 00:13:06,840 --> 00:13:03,339 top-secret work but they saw this at 314 00:13:10,110 --> 00:13:06,850 about 11:00 p.m. on September 14th 315 00:13:12,030 --> 00:13:10,120 they were driving on the highway when 316 00:13:16,590 --> 00:13:12,040 they just noticed these lights they kept 317 00:13:18,900 --> 00:13:16,600 looking at it for a while until they you 318 00:13:21,750 --> 00:13:18,910 know they both couldn't realize what it 319 00:13:23,400 --> 00:13:21,760 was they thought perhaps and they 320 00:13:25,769 --> 00:13:23,410 noticed it was this large triangular 321 00:13:28,050 --> 00:13:25,779 craft they say so that's a really 322 00:13:30,180 --> 00:13:28,060 interesting report it just kind of 323 00:13:32,730 --> 00:13:30,190 blinked out and disappeared and 324 00:13:34,920 --> 00:13:32,740 unbelievable yeah I used to drive by 325 00:13:37,439 --> 00:13:34,930 when I was out in California used to 326 00:13:39,870 --> 00:13:37,449 drive by that that lab I remember was 327 00:13:42,420 --> 00:13:39,880 always very really very very hot there 328 00:13:44,880 --> 00:13:42,430 for some reason I would it was miserably 329 00:13:47,340 --> 00:13:44,890 hot wow that's weird 330 00:13:49,860 --> 00:13:47,350 yeah it's just one of those inland areas 331 00:13:51,540 --> 00:13:49,870 what if it's ran by reptilians and they 332 00:13:51,689 --> 00:13:51,550 like to keep it Hawking that's what it 333 00:13:54,449 --> 00:13:51,699 is 334 00:13:56,910 --> 00:13:54,459 yeah okay there we go it figure it out 335 00:14:00,300 --> 00:13:56,920 yes that's the other ones one from North 336 00:14:03,269 --> 00:14:00,310 Carolina and what you know this guy said 337 00:14:06,030 --> 00:14:03,279 he saw a star-like object moving slowly 338 00:14:09,740 --> 00:14:06,040 from the south to the north that 339 00:14:13,920 --> 00:14:09,750 normally would not sound so mysterious 340 00:14:18,269 --> 00:14:13,930 this is about 9:00 p.m. on June 26 of 341 00:14:20,850 --> 00:14:18,279 this year but he said that it moved in 342 00:14:24,319 --> 00:14:20,860 one direction slowly and then it turned 343 00:14:27,750 --> 00:14:24,329 around and moved the other direction and 344 00:14:30,180 --> 00:14:27,760 he's got a video of it and it's hard to 345 00:14:32,460 --> 00:14:30,190 tell but in the video it looks like this 346 00:14:34,439 --> 00:14:32,470 light does exactly what he says that 347 00:14:36,870 --> 00:14:34,449 it's moving solely in one direction and 348 00:14:40,019 --> 00:14:36,880 then moves back now he does pick up the 349 00:14:42,150 --> 00:14:40,029 camera and move so it could be that it's 350 00:14:45,050 --> 00:14:42,160 the movement of the camera and not the 351 00:14:49,829 --> 00:14:45,060 object and it could have been a star but 352 00:14:53,340 --> 00:14:49,839 but I think he said otherwise he thought 353 00:14:55,889 --> 00:14:53,350 you move in a zigzag motion and then 354 00:14:57,540 --> 00:14:55,899 disappear so and what's interesting is 355 00:15:00,389 --> 00:14:57,550 in Colorado I've seen something like 356 00:15:02,460 --> 00:15:00,399 that however during the day you know I 357 00:15:04,380 --> 00:15:02,470 used to be really skeptical and I got to 358 00:15:06,210 --> 00:15:04,390 say you know I don't know what's going 359 00:15:09,120 --> 00:15:06,220 on with alien abductions or whatever 360 00:15:11,819 --> 00:15:09,130 this girl had said she was abducted by 361 00:15:14,699 --> 00:15:11,829 aliens but we started hanging out we 362 00:15:16,290 --> 00:15:14,709 became good friends and she at first 363 00:15:19,679 --> 00:15:16,300 would ask me you know why don't you come 364 00:15:21,460 --> 00:15:19,689 hang out and you know I'll show you that 365 00:15:24,970 --> 00:15:21,470 I see these these little 366 00:15:26,470 --> 00:15:24,980 or things and so we were hanging out you 367 00:15:28,270 --> 00:15:26,480 know I thought it'd be sitting outside 368 00:15:30,250 --> 00:15:28,280 for a while but we're just in her house 369 00:15:32,650 --> 00:15:30,260 hanging out for a while and she would 370 00:15:33,970 --> 00:15:32,660 say let's go outside and she would just 371 00:15:36,520 --> 00:15:33,980 want to go for a couple minutes because 372 00:15:38,290 --> 00:15:36,530 she kind of sent something and you know 373 00:15:40,720 --> 00:15:38,300 one of these times off in the distance 374 00:15:44,050 --> 00:15:40,730 there was this little light and I just 375 00:15:46,450 --> 00:15:44,060 sat there for during the day Wow for a 376 00:15:49,120 --> 00:15:46,460 while then it moved to the right really 377 00:15:51,730 --> 00:15:49,130 slowly then it moved to the left and 378 00:15:53,890 --> 00:15:51,740 then it just faded out kind of like what 379 00:15:56,860 --> 00:15:53,900 this thing's doing so a really 380 00:15:58,870 --> 00:15:56,870 interesting video there however the most 381 00:16:01,510 --> 00:15:58,880 interesting video we've had in a while 382 00:16:04,900 --> 00:16:01,520 is our at least since you've been gone 383 00:16:08,020 --> 00:16:04,910 is this one in Houston that Roger just 384 00:16:11,710 --> 00:16:08,030 posted today this is another MUFON case 385 00:16:14,610 --> 00:16:11,720 all of these are but this one's from 386 00:16:18,010 --> 00:16:14,620 March 30th and it was taken at 2:30 a.m. 387 00:16:20,710 --> 00:16:18,020 this witness says that they were outside 388 00:16:23,700 --> 00:16:20,720 when they saw a strange object that to 389 00:16:27,100 --> 00:16:23,710 them look metallic gray and spherical 390 00:16:28,960 --> 00:16:27,110 however in the video the video is weird 391 00:16:30,850 --> 00:16:28,970 it almost looks like the camera is kind 392 00:16:34,090 --> 00:16:30,860 of a bad camera and it's making some 393 00:16:35,770 --> 00:16:34,100 kind of weird kind of effect but at one 394 00:16:37,960 --> 00:16:35,780 point he zoomed out where you see the 395 00:16:39,910 --> 00:16:37,970 lights of the city and a streetlight and 396 00:16:42,460 --> 00:16:39,920 a light you know out there in the 397 00:16:44,860 --> 00:16:42,470 distance and when he zooms in on this 398 00:16:47,680 --> 00:16:44,870 light it's actually kind of like 399 00:16:50,650 --> 00:16:47,690 multiple lights you know moving around 400 00:16:54,730 --> 00:16:50,660 it's so weird 401 00:16:57,190 --> 00:16:54,740 it is a really weird video I have I 402 00:17:01,810 --> 00:16:57,200 can't make heads or tail of this thing 403 00:17:04,840 --> 00:17:01,820 that was investigated by the Texas State 404 00:17:09,490 --> 00:17:04,850 section director Arthur Goodrich and he 405 00:17:11,890 --> 00:17:09,500 closed it as an unknown in May but yeah 406 00:17:13,900 --> 00:17:11,900 it's a really weird video I don't know 407 00:17:16,510 --> 00:17:13,910 what the heck is going on here so one 408 00:17:18,069 --> 00:17:16,520 more thing before before we close out 409 00:17:19,210 --> 00:17:18,079 the news here what do you think about 410 00:17:22,660 --> 00:17:19,220 this 411 00:17:26,160 --> 00:17:22,670 NASA's report on salt water on Mars is 412 00:17:28,630 --> 00:17:26,170 pretty interesting huh yeah I think that 413 00:17:30,669 --> 00:17:28,640 my stepdad is not going to be able to 414 00:17:34,210 --> 00:17:30,679 get out of this one because we have a 415 00:17:34,710 --> 00:17:34,220 long-standing bet I bet him probably 10 416 00:17:38,100 --> 00:17:34,720 years 417 00:17:39,899 --> 00:17:38,110 not longer that there would be standing 418 00:17:42,539 --> 00:17:39,909 water on Mars just because we started 419 00:17:45,120 --> 00:17:42,549 getting good pictures I even went to a 420 00:17:48,169 --> 00:17:45,130 lecture with the guy who heads JPL I 421 00:17:52,230 --> 00:17:48,179 can't remember his name at the Museum in 422 00:17:54,690 --> 00:17:52,240 Denver and he felt that way too and you 423 00:17:56,909 --> 00:17:54,700 know and well actually I just had water 424 00:17:59,430 --> 00:17:56,919 on Mars and when when they found it in 425 00:18:00,779 --> 00:17:59,440 the atmosphere my stepdad Wow no no no 426 00:18:03,659 --> 00:18:00,789 and he kept adding to it and then 427 00:18:06,990 --> 00:18:03,669 finally said standing water on Mars and 428 00:18:08,880 --> 00:18:07,000 now they found evidence of it so I think 429 00:18:10,560 --> 00:18:08,890 it's awesome I think it's really 430 00:18:13,169 --> 00:18:10,570 interesting I think that there have been 431 00:18:15,180 --> 00:18:13,179 lots of features that show that it's 432 00:18:19,200 --> 00:18:15,190 certainly a possibility so it's cool 433 00:18:20,730 --> 00:18:19,210 that they've been able to confirm it and 434 00:18:22,350 --> 00:18:20,740 I think people have to remember that 435 00:18:25,049 --> 00:18:22,360 when it comes to NASA you know a lot of 436 00:18:26,700 --> 00:18:25,059 people say oh do you know like Ridley 437 00:18:30,510 --> 00:18:26,710 Scott said I knew that a long time ago 438 00:18:32,399 --> 00:18:30,520 but you know with with NASA they're very 439 00:18:34,080 --> 00:18:32,409 careful and they want to prove it before 440 00:18:37,380 --> 00:18:34,090 they announce it they just don't want to 441 00:18:40,110 --> 00:18:37,390 speculate which is all it is prior to 442 00:18:41,940 --> 00:18:40,120 that so that's why NASA is late in the 443 00:18:43,740 --> 00:18:41,950 game work but when they say it you know 444 00:18:47,159 --> 00:18:43,750 you can be pretty sure it's been 445 00:18:49,440 --> 00:18:47,169 confirmed so it's another step hopefully 446 00:18:52,200 --> 00:18:49,450 now they send a rover or hopefully we'll 447 00:18:54,720 --> 00:18:52,210 see what happens next but again it's 448 00:18:56,039 --> 00:18:54,730 just like you know a lot of us were like 449 00:18:59,610 --> 00:18:56,049 we've talked about we feel like we're on 450 00:19:01,950 --> 00:18:59,620 the precipice of you know even microbial 451 00:19:04,529 --> 00:19:01,960 life being discovered elsewhere and 452 00:19:07,770 --> 00:19:04,539 we're just getting closer and closer to 453 00:19:09,960 --> 00:19:07,780 it so it's it's very very very exciting 454 00:19:13,350 --> 00:19:09,970 I think yes I just want to know how much 455 00:19:14,909 --> 00:19:13,360 did you bet well I don't want to 456 00:19:16,919 --> 00:19:14,919 disclose it it's a good amount of money 457 00:19:21,120 --> 00:19:16,929 Oh exactly a large amount of money 458 00:19:23,580 --> 00:19:21,130 however over the years I have he's 459 00:19:28,919 --> 00:19:23,590 probably spent you know a hundred fold 460 00:19:32,070 --> 00:19:28,929 on me well no there's no way I kid in 461 00:19:34,110 --> 00:19:32,080 could just go collect from him but 462 00:19:36,090 --> 00:19:34,120 bragging rights are a good guy for me 463 00:19:38,279 --> 00:19:36,100 yeah that's right that's right hey you 464 00:19:40,350 --> 00:19:38,289 know what on the way back from Russia I 465 00:19:44,070 --> 00:19:40,360 watched the movie contact now I haven't 466 00:19:46,409 --> 00:19:44,080 seen it since the game out and boy that 467 00:19:46,950 --> 00:19:46,419 was really good to watch that movie 468 00:19:51,840 --> 00:19:46,960 after 469 00:19:53,250 --> 00:19:51,850 talking to all these people some of the 470 00:19:54,960 --> 00:19:53,260 things that were said in the show are 471 00:19:56,730 --> 00:19:54,970 things that some of the people have 472 00:19:58,800 --> 00:19:56,740 quoted on you know some of the guests of 473 00:20:01,260 --> 00:19:58,810 quoted you know for instance Jeffrey 474 00:20:04,980 --> 00:20:01,270 Bennett says that his colleagues and 475 00:20:08,190 --> 00:20:04,990 himself say that if a civilization can 476 00:20:09,900 --> 00:20:08,200 go through a bit of high-technology 477 00:20:12,000 --> 00:20:09,910 without destroying themselves they'll 478 00:20:14,220 --> 00:20:12,010 eventually travel the Stars and that was 479 00:20:16,860 --> 00:20:14,230 more or less said in that movie 480 00:20:19,380 --> 00:20:16,870 um a lot of things like I said well Carl 481 00:20:21,570 --> 00:20:19,390 Sagan feels the same way he felt that if 482 00:20:24,150 --> 00:20:21,580 we are if there are advanced 483 00:20:28,850 --> 00:20:24,160 civilizations out there that they would 484 00:20:32,190 --> 00:20:28,860 be most likely have overcome social 485 00:20:36,150 --> 00:20:32,200 problems as well so yeah he's he felt 486 00:20:38,130 --> 00:20:36,160 like that the entire time and so do many 487 00:20:40,710 --> 00:20:38,140 many of the SETI scientists of course 488 00:20:42,990 --> 00:20:40,720 there's more stories out today about how 489 00:20:47,040 --> 00:20:43,000 Stephen Hawking does not feel the same 490 00:20:48,630 --> 00:20:47,050 way yeah yeah well you know he has a 491 00:20:52,080 --> 00:20:48,640 right to have his own opinion right 492 00:20:55,410 --> 00:20:52,090 right yeah whether we agree or not but 493 00:20:56,940 --> 00:20:55,420 right anyway you have a good one sir and 494 00:20:59,460 --> 00:20:56,950 we'll be talking to you next week 495 00:21:00,780 --> 00:20:59,470 you too we'll talk to you soon happy to 496 00:21:04,080 --> 00:21:00,790 have you back in the States 497 00:21:06,390 --> 00:21:04,090 safe and sound thank you and your - I'm 498 00:21:09,390 --> 00:21:06,400 sure yes my chihuahua has no jet lag but 499 00:21:11,190 --> 00:21:09,400 I do good so anyway so hanging everyone 500 00:21:13,170 --> 00:21:11,200 we'll be right back we have some new 501 00:21:16,110 --> 00:21:13,180 music by Carrie Lloyd Whitehouse he 502 00:21:18,690 --> 00:21:16,120 dedicated an entire album to our past 503 00:21:21,210 --> 00:21:18,700 astronomer who passed away recently 504 00:21:22,830 --> 00:21:21,220 Andy Fleming so here's a clip from 505 00:23:12,220 --> 00:21:22,840 Carrie Lloyd Wright house and we'll be 506 00:23:18,200 --> 00:23:16,600 hit me hello John welcome to the show 507 00:23:22,670 --> 00:23:18,210 thank you much 508 00:23:24,920 --> 00:23:22,680 yes John so I have been wanting to get 509 00:23:26,210 --> 00:23:24,930 you on the show for a long time could 510 00:23:26,930 --> 00:23:26,220 you pull up a little closer to your 511 00:23:32,420 --> 00:23:26,940 phone please 512 00:23:36,980 --> 00:23:32,430 the producer of the show okay all right 513 00:23:39,320 --> 00:23:36,990 so John for the the person that is not 514 00:23:42,560 --> 00:23:39,330 aware of your background I'd like to go 515 00:23:46,070 --> 00:23:42,570 over your military career and how you 516 00:23:48,670 --> 00:23:46,080 get fascinated into the with the UFO 517 00:23:51,650 --> 00:23:48,680 topic and other paranormal topics and 518 00:23:56,150 --> 00:23:51,660 other things that you've actually had an 519 00:23:59,180 --> 00:23:56,160 open mind enough to look into I think 520 00:24:00,860 --> 00:23:59,190 it's all fascinating and I also and the 521 00:24:03,950 --> 00:24:00,870 second hour we'll talk about skinwalker 522 00:24:06,290 --> 00:24:03,960 ranch you're one of the people that were 523 00:24:09,430 --> 00:24:06,300 actually on site there doing some 524 00:24:12,800 --> 00:24:09,440 research I'd like to talk about that and 525 00:24:17,300 --> 00:24:12,810 so let's get started with uh with your 526 00:24:20,480 --> 00:24:17,310 background if you would well you've got 527 00:24:20,980 --> 00:24:20,490 that post isms for the military for 32 528 00:24:24,890 --> 00:24:20,990 years 529 00:24:28,820 --> 00:24:24,900 second career was Los Alamos National 530 00:24:30,890 --> 00:24:28,830 Laboratory and came over here worked 531 00:24:34,580 --> 00:24:30,900 part time with Bob Bigelow and the 532 00:24:38,470 --> 00:24:34,590 Nationalists to discovery science been 533 00:24:42,680 --> 00:24:38,480 about 10 years as a senior fellow with 534 00:24:48,320 --> 00:24:42,690 Joint Special Operations University sit 535 00:24:50,930 --> 00:24:48,330 back and write interesting material and 536 00:24:56,690 --> 00:24:50,940 monographs and thinking about strategic 537 00:25:01,130 --> 00:24:56,700 issues so uh-huh and so in your military 538 00:25:03,800 --> 00:25:01,140 career when you were in the Army did you 539 00:25:10,130 --> 00:25:03,810 at that time did you have a fascination 540 00:25:14,450 --> 00:25:10,140 with UFOs well I started that when I was 541 00:25:16,880 --> 00:25:14,460 10 years old so yeah it always sort of 542 00:25:18,970 --> 00:25:16,890 continued there so oh how did that how 543 00:25:23,200 --> 00:25:18,980 did that come about a 10 year 544 00:25:26,049 --> 00:25:23,210 I just when Jen Arnold sighting came out 545 00:25:29,799 --> 00:25:26,059 and all all blue was going up at that 546 00:25:33,730 --> 00:25:29,809 time it definitely got my attention I 547 00:25:36,580 --> 00:25:33,740 remember I went to a very unusual grade 548 00:25:39,520 --> 00:25:36,590 school that had an internal radio system 549 00:25:42,580 --> 00:25:39,530 and the students would give a little bit 550 00:25:45,310 --> 00:25:42,590 yet over the school radio and I remember 551 00:25:49,990 --> 00:25:45,320 that was one of the topics that I chose 552 00:25:53,789 --> 00:25:50,000 to talk about that was 1947 wow that's 553 00:25:58,240 --> 00:25:53,799 amazing you know I grew up in Maine 554 00:26:00,789 --> 00:25:58,250 basically where I'm at now and we had I 555 00:26:02,549 --> 00:26:00,799 remember there was a flap you know they 556 00:26:05,230 --> 00:26:02,559 called it the New England flap but 557 00:26:07,330 --> 00:26:05,240 that's what they call it now but back 558 00:26:12,220 --> 00:26:07,340 then it just seemed like there was a lot 559 00:26:14,940 --> 00:26:12,230 of UFOs happening at that time and so I 560 00:26:18,580 --> 00:26:14,950 sort of had an interest in it you know 561 00:26:21,100 --> 00:26:18,590 but I had never seen anything until you 562 00:26:24,940 --> 00:26:21,110 know just a number of years ago but 563 00:26:26,590 --> 00:26:24,950 before that I always had like some type 564 00:26:31,330 --> 00:26:26,600 a little bit of a fascination and 565 00:26:34,150 --> 00:26:31,340 definitely an open mind about it now you 566 00:26:35,950 --> 00:26:34,160 have one of the things I do want to talk 567 00:26:38,049 --> 00:26:35,960 about is you know you've ruffled a lot 568 00:26:41,350 --> 00:26:38,059 of feathers here and there in the UFO 569 00:26:43,810 --> 00:26:41,360 field because I think you're someone 570 00:26:47,740 --> 00:26:43,820 that says it the way it is a lot of 571 00:26:51,010 --> 00:26:47,750 times and since you've been at this so 572 00:26:52,390 --> 00:26:51,020 long I'm sure you've seen a lot of 573 00:26:56,520 --> 00:26:52,400 changes and you've had a lot of 574 00:27:00,730 --> 00:26:56,530 connections too I saw that you you were 575 00:27:03,490 --> 00:27:00,740 friends with was it Hal put off is that 576 00:27:07,780 --> 00:27:03,500 one of the people oh yeah for decades 577 00:27:11,380 --> 00:27:07,790 yeah interesting man right there and 578 00:27:16,600 --> 00:27:11,390 also you knew John Mac all kinds of 579 00:27:18,549 --> 00:27:16,610 people so as far as being getting 580 00:27:26,950 --> 00:27:18,559 involved in the field itself when did 581 00:27:28,960 --> 00:27:26,960 when did that start I guess in 1947 it 582 00:27:34,070 --> 00:27:28,970 started with you know individual 583 00:27:39,150 --> 00:27:36,930 don't know I mean I'd always you're 584 00:27:40,350 --> 00:27:39,160 looking for I mean just interest has 585 00:27:44,940 --> 00:27:40,360 always been there and I've taken 586 00:27:50,850 --> 00:27:44,950 advantage of the various situations to 587 00:27:53,940 --> 00:27:50,860 be able to explore the topics and you 588 00:27:55,650 --> 00:27:53,950 know I did this is a main topic of the 589 00:28:00,420 --> 00:27:55,660 book of course is that I had put 590 00:28:04,340 --> 00:28:00,430 together a internal study group to look 591 00:28:07,260 --> 00:28:04,350 into the field and I guess where the 592 00:28:10,530 --> 00:28:07,270 feathers get ruffled is that what we 593 00:28:14,700 --> 00:28:10,540 found was certainly not what we expected 594 00:28:22,470 --> 00:28:14,710 we we expected pretty much foot you know 595 00:28:25,380 --> 00:28:22,480 a popular folklore says and you noticed 596 00:28:29,760 --> 00:28:25,390 I ended up as a I mentioned there 597 00:28:35,580 --> 00:28:29,770 talking to many many very senior people 598 00:28:37,890 --> 00:28:35,590 um it's a little complex in that I do 599 00:28:39,600 --> 00:28:37,900 think there are people you know in the 600 00:28:42,150 --> 00:28:39,610 government or wretches and I think one 601 00:28:46,740 --> 00:28:42,160 of the biggest problems is that people 602 00:28:50,670 --> 00:28:46,750 assume that the government is some big 603 00:28:53,420 --> 00:28:50,680 monolithic entity that everybody thinks 604 00:28:56,400 --> 00:28:53,430 alike um the thing I find most 605 00:28:59,610 --> 00:28:56,410 fascinating is the economy that 606 00:29:01,520 --> 00:28:59,620 basically we think that the government's 607 00:29:06,620 --> 00:29:01,530 totally incompetent 608 00:29:10,980 --> 00:29:06,630 except for UFOs where they're omniscient 609 00:29:16,320 --> 00:29:10,990 that's a really good point and now did I 610 00:29:18,920 --> 00:29:16,330 see a documentary um it could have been 611 00:29:22,410 --> 00:29:18,930 you in it that was actually trying to 612 00:29:23,580 --> 00:29:22,420 see how deeply you could go into the 613 00:29:27,510 --> 00:29:23,590 government to see if there was anything 614 00:29:29,820 --> 00:29:27,520 hidden was that you I don't know about 615 00:29:31,920 --> 00:29:29,830 that what the documentary with Danna - 616 00:29:38,070 --> 00:29:31,930 no I've been on a number of shows of 617 00:29:39,630 --> 00:29:38,080 course um but so did you do research let 618 00:29:43,890 --> 00:29:39,640 me put it this way did you do research 619 00:29:46,259 --> 00:29:43,900 to see if you could find any links of 620 00:29:50,009 --> 00:29:46,269 the government 621 00:29:56,039 --> 00:29:50,019 see on ufos yeah like I said I was 622 00:29:59,879 --> 00:29:56,049 running a top-secret local group that we 623 00:30:01,829 --> 00:29:59,889 explored this and when in assuming that 624 00:30:05,579 --> 00:30:01,839 that was in fact the case 625 00:30:14,339 --> 00:30:05,589 I have come to kind of different 626 00:30:16,969 --> 00:30:14,349 conclusions now that and we certainly 627 00:30:22,769 --> 00:30:16,979 look into it and considerable depth 628 00:30:24,629 --> 00:30:22,779 uh-huh and because you hear a lot of you 629 00:30:27,719 --> 00:30:24,639 know a lot of speculation like you said 630 00:30:31,349 --> 00:30:27,729 earlier but also you hear speculation 631 00:30:35,369 --> 00:30:31,359 that there's one small part of the 632 00:30:39,269 --> 00:30:35,379 government that you know as as time goes 633 00:30:42,509 --> 00:30:39,279 on going back to like say 1947 there was 634 00:30:45,209 --> 00:30:42,519 one small part of the government that 635 00:30:47,729 --> 00:30:45,219 was keeping their eyes on you know the 636 00:30:50,849 --> 00:30:47,739 UFO subject and then there was Project 637 00:30:55,589 --> 00:30:50,859 Blue Book and well before that those of 638 00:30:58,949 --> 00:30:55,599 the other two organizations as far as 639 00:31:00,449 --> 00:30:58,959 the Air Force goes project sign and what 640 00:31:07,499 --> 00:31:00,459 it's the other one I just can't think of 641 00:31:09,779 --> 00:31:07,509 it grow okay yeah so would you disagree 642 00:31:11,519 --> 00:31:09,789 with that statement that there's do you 643 00:31:14,519 --> 00:31:11,529 think that at this time there's no part 644 00:31:16,589 --> 00:31:14,529 of the government or Air Force or NORAD 645 00:31:18,560 --> 00:31:16,599 or anything like that that has any 646 00:31:21,029 --> 00:31:18,570 interest in UFOs or do you think they're 647 00:31:24,329 --> 00:31:21,039 monitored because you I think there are 648 00:31:28,619 --> 00:31:24,339 people remember we're talking about very 649 00:31:30,899 --> 00:31:28,629 very large institutions and that what we 650 00:31:33,719 --> 00:31:30,909 know is that the adult population 651 00:31:38,009 --> 00:31:33,729 somewhere between seven and ten percent 652 00:31:41,279 --> 00:31:38,019 of the people of actually seen UFOs so 653 00:31:44,699 --> 00:31:41,289 that number applies to people in the 654 00:31:48,029 --> 00:31:44,709 government as well so I'm sure there are 655 00:31:50,729 --> 00:31:48,039 people who you know have interests now I 656 00:31:53,789 --> 00:31:50,739 mean you start laying out some timelines 657 00:31:57,670 --> 00:31:53,799 and you realize the people that are in 658 00:32:04,000 --> 00:32:01,180 all the started so you've got to be 659 00:32:08,220 --> 00:32:04,010 talking about groups that change over 660 00:32:11,200 --> 00:32:08,230 first with a fair degree regularity and 661 00:32:13,450 --> 00:32:11,210 you know I just have problems I am sure 662 00:32:16,750 --> 00:32:13,460 there are people who are interested and 663 00:32:21,010 --> 00:32:16,760 you know follow up to some degree what 664 00:32:23,560 --> 00:32:21,020 I'm not sure of is you know I I don't 665 00:32:25,930 --> 00:32:23,570 see any massive cover-up that mean I've 666 00:32:29,800 --> 00:32:25,940 given talks as I have good news and bad 667 00:32:31,720 --> 00:32:29,810 news and government the good news is the 668 00:32:34,090 --> 00:32:31,730 government's been telling the truth 669 00:32:37,390 --> 00:32:34,100 the bad news is the government's been 670 00:32:39,790 --> 00:32:37,400 telling the truth reality is from an 671 00:32:42,640 --> 00:32:39,800 institutional perspective really don't 672 00:32:45,040 --> 00:32:42,650 care I mean this is people don't 673 00:32:49,620 --> 00:32:45,050 understand that and the problem is that 674 00:32:54,520 --> 00:32:49,630 the UFO community such as it is is 675 00:32:58,630 --> 00:32:54,530 totally incestuous in myopic and they 676 00:33:03,490 --> 00:32:58,640 believe that this is you know biggest 677 00:33:04,270 --> 00:33:03,500 thing since sex and sliced bread well it 678 00:33:06,670 --> 00:33:04,280 is 679 00:33:10,750 --> 00:33:06,680 there's Wars going on and most of the 680 00:33:14,080 --> 00:33:10,760 emphasis is on that sort of effort well 681 00:33:16,380 --> 00:33:14,090 alright let's let's look at it there 682 00:33:24,120 --> 00:33:16,390 must be a part of the government that 683 00:33:26,650 --> 00:33:24,130 sort of is similar to this talk why 684 00:33:32,380 --> 00:33:26,660 you know because let's just say that 685 00:33:35,400 --> 00:33:32,390 there must be some part of something I'm 686 00:33:39,010 --> 00:33:35,410 trying to do a parallel here with what 687 00:33:42,850 --> 00:33:39,020 would go through time being passed down 688 00:33:45,940 --> 00:33:42,860 to other people like you mentioned 689 00:33:50,320 --> 00:33:45,950 earlier that people weren't even born 690 00:33:52,300 --> 00:33:50,330 you know when Roswell happened so but 691 00:33:55,270 --> 00:33:52,310 I'm just saying there's parts of the 692 00:33:56,500 --> 00:33:55,280 government that are kept on autopsy 693 00:33:58,390 --> 00:33:56,510 cordon well 694 00:34:01,060 --> 00:33:58,400 no I'm saying there are parts of the 695 00:34:04,690 --> 00:34:01,070 government that's kept topside which 696 00:34:07,000 --> 00:34:04,700 port is it I'm not being I'm not being 697 00:34:10,540 --> 00:34:07,010 specific I'm just saying that I know 698 00:34:11,619 --> 00:34:10,550 that that is the problem and this is you 699 00:34:15,579 --> 00:34:11,629 know like one of the law 700 00:34:17,950 --> 00:34:15,589 chapters in the book is people just do 701 00:34:21,730 --> 00:34:17,960 not understand how the government works 702 00:34:26,829 --> 00:34:21,740 and again you get back to this dichotomy 703 00:34:28,629 --> 00:34:26,839 of you know being incompetent to handle 704 00:34:30,700 --> 00:34:28,639 anything certainly not going to handle 705 00:34:32,230 --> 00:34:30,710 health care and don't bill all right 706 00:34:34,990 --> 00:34:32,240 well let's just say the government's 707 00:34:36,389 --> 00:34:35,000 incompetent except for this little tiny 708 00:34:38,289 --> 00:34:36,399 niche 709 00:34:39,999 --> 00:34:38,299 alright well they're not going to share 710 00:34:42,249 --> 00:34:40,009 their secrets on how they made a nuclear 711 00:34:47,409 --> 00:34:42,259 bomb let's just say that okay that was 712 00:34:48,460 --> 00:34:47,419 in the 1940s what's that we have so I'm 713 00:34:49,419 --> 00:34:48,470 not going to be able to come up with a 714 00:34:53,499 --> 00:34:49,429 good example 715 00:34:56,640 --> 00:34:53,509 it sounds like pick one stealth is a 716 00:34:58,480 --> 00:34:56,650 good example I mean all of these things 717 00:35:02,319 --> 00:34:58,490 at that time I worked 718 00:35:05,440 --> 00:35:02,329 remember Los Alamos my second career was 719 00:35:08,170 --> 00:35:05,450 place at brunch of the bomb I had a 720 00:35:10,180 --> 00:35:08,180 friend who was very high he had to wait 721 00:35:12,329 --> 00:35:10,190 a long time to get clearances and so 722 00:35:17,470 --> 00:35:12,339 what the he was a nuclear physicist and 723 00:35:18,730 --> 00:35:17,480 this would have been 70s early 80s and 724 00:35:21,970 --> 00:35:18,740 they said okay while you're waiting for 725 00:35:24,579 --> 00:35:21,980 your clearance um figure out how to make 726 00:35:26,499 --> 00:35:24,589 a nuclear bomb from open source 727 00:35:29,680 --> 00:35:26,509 literature and this is before the days 728 00:35:31,990 --> 00:35:29,690 of the internet and was able to do it so 729 00:35:35,410 --> 00:35:32,000 those secrets are out there unless that 730 00:35:38,579 --> 00:35:35,420 is one of the problems most of this 731 00:35:44,170 --> 00:35:38,589 information is just totally available 732 00:35:47,710 --> 00:35:44,180 well why wouldn't what let's just say 733 00:35:50,380 --> 00:35:47,720 that there are a lot of sightings 734 00:35:52,150 --> 00:35:50,390 there's a lot of inaudible lutely 735 00:35:56,140 --> 00:35:52,160 and out of those sightings there's a lot 736 00:35:58,150 --> 00:35:56,150 of unexplainable sightings sure and so 737 00:36:01,660 --> 00:35:58,160 why wouldn't the government have an 738 00:36:05,370 --> 00:36:01,670 interest in that because the government 739 00:36:08,620 --> 00:36:05,380 does not have a department of good ideas 740 00:36:11,109 --> 00:36:08,630 and that's sort of what we think of it 741 00:36:13,120 --> 00:36:11,119 would and this is their very serious 742 00:36:17,829 --> 00:36:13,130 stuff this is a total lack of 743 00:36:20,170 --> 00:36:17,839 understanding and you know like deep 744 00:36:22,240 --> 00:36:20,180 throat said follow the money so you look 745 00:36:25,270 --> 00:36:22,250 at the money trail see how does that 746 00:36:27,220 --> 00:36:25,280 system work by the way this is 747 00:36:32,410 --> 00:36:27,230 justifying to people in the government 748 00:36:36,400 --> 00:36:32,420 as well but basically you do what we 749 00:36:38,230 --> 00:36:36,410 call rack and stack you line up all of 750 00:36:42,370 --> 00:36:38,240 the things that you're required to take 751 00:36:45,670 --> 00:36:42,380 care of and then you allocate your funds 752 00:36:48,610 --> 00:36:45,680 against that and the problem is that in 753 00:36:50,590 --> 00:36:48,620 all cases you run out of money long 754 00:36:54,790 --> 00:36:50,600 before you run out of things that you 755 00:36:56,530 --> 00:36:54,800 really ought to be exploring do your 756 00:36:59,740 --> 00:36:56,540 poll thing because but I'm going to 757 00:37:03,190 --> 00:36:59,750 counter and say you know there are 758 00:37:06,370 --> 00:37:03,200 miracles that go on on a contingent in 759 00:37:08,260 --> 00:37:06,380 Lluis basis and yet for some reason the 760 00:37:12,160 --> 00:37:08,270 UFO community thinks the government 761 00:37:14,830 --> 00:37:12,170 ought to be involved in this why on the 762 00:37:16,630 --> 00:37:14,840 same you know wavelength would they not 763 00:37:19,720 --> 00:37:16,640 be responsible for investigating 764 00:37:24,700 --> 00:37:19,730 miracles that happen all the time we 765 00:37:32,620 --> 00:37:24,710 have no expectation of that well I think 766 00:37:34,870 --> 00:37:32,630 that miracles are as you say that can't 767 00:37:37,890 --> 00:37:34,880 be explained yes they can really be 768 00:37:40,620 --> 00:37:37,900 something but if it actually comes to a 769 00:37:42,730 --> 00:37:40,630 possibility of say extraterrestrials 770 00:37:45,280 --> 00:37:42,740 visiting us I'm not saying because I 771 00:37:48,070 --> 00:37:45,290 really don't know but let's just not we 772 00:37:49,810 --> 00:37:48,080 we talked about there have been this is 773 00:37:51,940 --> 00:37:49,820 a very important issue one that I 774 00:37:55,960 --> 00:37:51,950 address in the community doesn't like it 775 00:37:59,230 --> 00:37:55,970 but the point is we have had reports of 776 00:38:02,560 --> 00:37:59,240 contact between sentient non-human 777 00:38:05,130 --> 00:38:02,570 beings and humans throughout the 778 00:38:10,030 --> 00:38:05,140 entirety of human history 779 00:38:15,160 --> 00:38:10,040 this shows up in ethology folklore in 780 00:38:17,350 --> 00:38:15,170 basically every country in the world and 781 00:38:19,840 --> 00:38:17,360 yet we do not expect the government to 782 00:38:22,690 --> 00:38:19,850 be interested in that and that may well 783 00:38:25,870 --> 00:38:22,700 be one of my early slides and all 784 00:38:28,450 --> 00:38:25,880 briefings that I get now is that I take 785 00:38:31,330 --> 00:38:28,460 and UFOs a small piece you know I've 786 00:38:34,770 --> 00:38:31,340 been involved with psychokinesis remote 787 00:38:39,040 --> 00:38:34,780 viewing near-death studies Boulder guys 788 00:38:40,810 --> 00:38:39,050 firewalking you name it I am first 789 00:38:44,560 --> 00:38:40,820 they convinced that there is some 790 00:38:46,630 --> 00:38:44,570 linkage between all of those things but 791 00:38:50,410 --> 00:38:46,640 we tend to and one of the big problems 792 00:38:52,450 --> 00:38:50,420 in understanding or coming to a 793 00:38:55,840 --> 00:38:52,460 theoretical basis for understanding 794 00:38:56,770 --> 00:38:55,850 these phenomena is everybody wants the 795 00:38:58,660 --> 00:38:56,780 stovepipe 796 00:39:00,490 --> 00:38:58,670 in other words I'm going to talk about 797 00:39:04,420 --> 00:39:00,500 you know I'm going to challenge you and 798 00:39:09,880 --> 00:39:04,430 say what do you mean by a UFO you can't 799 00:39:12,130 --> 00:39:09,890 even come up with a viable definition my 800 00:39:15,970 --> 00:39:12,140 point is that I got little balls of 801 00:39:20,260 --> 00:39:15,980 light floating around I've got huge 802 00:39:22,680 --> 00:39:20,270 craft with political evidence of things 803 00:39:25,260 --> 00:39:22,690 more than a mile across maybe 804 00:39:28,690 --> 00:39:25,270 considerably more than that and 805 00:39:33,640 --> 00:39:28,700 everything in between so which ones are 806 00:39:37,900 --> 00:39:33,650 UFOs and which ones are no what we're 807 00:39:39,990 --> 00:39:37,910 studying yeah I say that a lot said that 808 00:39:42,190 --> 00:39:40,000 quite a bit on on this show like it's 809 00:39:43,840 --> 00:39:42,200 whatever it is it could be something we 810 00:39:48,250 --> 00:39:43,850 haven't even thought of you know I mean 811 00:39:50,440 --> 00:39:48,260 or the first paragraph or the first 812 00:39:54,790 --> 00:39:50,450 sentence in the book that I wrote was 813 00:39:58,690 --> 00:39:54,800 UFOs are real and by that I mean very 814 00:40:01,930 --> 00:39:58,700 physical tangible you know vehicles that 815 00:40:05,170 --> 00:40:01,940 are out there but I am just by saying 816 00:40:07,600 --> 00:40:05,180 whatever this is it is more complex than 817 00:40:10,630 --> 00:40:07,610 we ever imagined and maybe then we can 818 00:40:13,000 --> 00:40:10,640 imagine and I argue we're not at the 819 00:40:16,930 --> 00:40:13,010 point of asking the right questions 820 00:40:20,500 --> 00:40:16,940 much less coming up with answers okay up 821 00:40:23,800 --> 00:40:20,510 on the chatroom let's see there's no 822 00:40:26,260 --> 00:40:23,810 doubt that the government military has 823 00:40:29,800 --> 00:40:26,270 proof of these unexplained craft that 824 00:40:31,720 --> 00:40:29,810 show up on radar so the government 825 00:40:36,880 --> 00:40:31,730 wouldn't be doing their job seriously 826 00:40:39,100 --> 00:40:36,890 well he keeps going on if well okay when 827 00:40:41,650 --> 00:40:39,110 I when I tell these folks is okay you 828 00:40:46,500 --> 00:40:41,660 are now the manager of whatever this 829 00:40:49,600 --> 00:40:46,510 organization is you have a finite budget 830 00:40:52,090 --> 00:40:49,610 how much of that budget do you want to 831 00:40:54,970 --> 00:40:52,100 expand on something as you have a 832 00:40:57,340 --> 00:40:54,980 very low probability of resolving hmm 833 00:41:00,190 --> 00:40:57,350 that's that's always the case and I 834 00:41:02,500 --> 00:41:00,200 think that's a lot of the times why the 835 00:41:05,590 --> 00:41:02,510 science community won't look into this 836 00:41:09,040 --> 00:41:05,600 because of the issue of actually solving 837 00:41:12,450 --> 00:41:09,050 it well no the scientific community is a 838 00:41:18,160 --> 00:41:12,460 different issue and I tend to blame 839 00:41:20,140 --> 00:41:18,170 Condon here um I also did a whole 840 00:41:22,930 --> 00:41:20,150 chapter on content as well and it's 841 00:41:26,170 --> 00:41:22,940 interesting because in fact Compton was 842 00:41:28,570 --> 00:41:26,180 right to a degree but people don't 843 00:41:32,860 --> 00:41:28,580 realize the question to Condon was not 844 00:41:36,670 --> 00:41:32,870 our UFOs real is was our UFOs a threat 845 00:41:39,910 --> 00:41:36,680 and he said no threat haven't been 846 00:41:43,120 --> 00:41:39,920 invaded so that's probably fairly 847 00:41:45,460 --> 00:41:43,130 accurate the problem was that he then 848 00:41:49,090 --> 00:41:45,470 went on to say and there's no scientific 849 00:41:51,220 --> 00:41:49,100 value in this the other problem is that 850 00:41:55,360 --> 00:41:51,230 there's a perception in the general 851 00:41:59,040 --> 00:41:55,370 scientific very thorough study when it 852 00:42:03,610 --> 00:41:59,050 was not it was a very cursory study the 853 00:42:06,430 --> 00:42:03,620 airports had trouble you know locate was 854 00:42:09,010 --> 00:42:06,440 really even do the study Condon was far 855 00:42:11,290 --> 00:42:09,020 from the first choice but he was the 856 00:42:14,320 --> 00:42:11,300 only one at the University of Colorado 857 00:42:20,920 --> 00:42:14,330 would step up and say you know we'll 858 00:42:22,990 --> 00:42:20,930 even participate right yep and now I 859 00:42:26,980 --> 00:42:23,000 think I spoke about this a while back 860 00:42:31,480 --> 00:42:26,990 worth if someone went against what the 861 00:42:33,700 --> 00:42:31,490 the path that he was going on they they 862 00:42:39,400 --> 00:42:33,710 were basically bumped out or a couple 863 00:42:41,590 --> 00:42:39,410 people were is that yeah now I just want 864 00:42:44,080 --> 00:42:41,600 to say they wrote after that effect to I 865 00:42:47,680 --> 00:42:44,090 mean the problem the kind of report 866 00:42:52,750 --> 00:42:47,690 itself is not that bad because if you 867 00:42:54,130 --> 00:42:52,760 read it it it basically says internally 868 00:42:57,610 --> 00:42:54,140 that there are a number of pretty damn 869 00:43:00,540 --> 00:42:57,620 good cases the problem was the condom 870 00:43:02,860 --> 00:43:00,550 who did not investigate any of the cases 871 00:43:04,180 --> 00:43:02,870 wrote the recommendations and 872 00:43:07,480 --> 00:43:04,190 conclusions 873 00:43:09,940 --> 00:43:07,490 and he concluded you know that there was 874 00:43:12,130 --> 00:43:09,950 nothing to it when in fact the body of 875 00:43:15,450 --> 00:43:12,140 the report disagrees 876 00:43:23,770 --> 00:43:15,460 you know it's internally in congruence 877 00:43:27,130 --> 00:43:23,780 Wow okay yeah and you hear a lot of 878 00:43:30,880 --> 00:43:27,140 people will quote the the Condon report 879 00:43:33,430 --> 00:43:30,890 as if it's um you know it's basically 880 00:43:35,829 --> 00:43:33,440 the Bible and you know I know it's the 881 00:43:39,430 --> 00:43:35,839 reason or what was used when they shut 882 00:43:42,400 --> 00:43:39,440 down Project Blue Book but I was 883 00:43:45,609 --> 00:43:42,410 understanding that was the answer that 884 00:43:48,640 --> 00:43:45,619 the air force water that was a foot up 885 00:43:51,579 --> 00:43:48,650 job the Air Force did not want to bother 886 00:43:56,079 --> 00:43:51,589 with UFOs you know just make this go 887 00:43:58,210 --> 00:43:56,089 away and the Condon report was designed 888 00:43:58,990 --> 00:43:58,220 to get that answer and they were 889 00:44:02,380 --> 00:43:59,000 successful 890 00:44:06,309 --> 00:44:02,390 basically went away now one of the 891 00:44:09,460 --> 00:44:06,319 things that that I am kind of curious 892 00:44:11,319 --> 00:44:09,470 about and that is a lot of the reports 893 00:44:14,710 --> 00:44:11,329 and actually I have a friend that 894 00:44:17,950 --> 00:44:14,720 actually saw this he saw a disc being 895 00:44:21,010 --> 00:44:17,960 chased by two Jets you know military 896 00:44:23,950 --> 00:44:21,020 jets and that is something you do hear 897 00:44:25,720 --> 00:44:23,960 about and what do you think happens when 898 00:44:27,910 --> 00:44:25,730 something like that I know I'm going a 899 00:44:29,260 --> 00:44:27,920 little around skipping around here a 900 00:44:32,170 --> 00:44:29,270 little bit but what do you think happens 901 00:44:34,809 --> 00:44:32,180 we know that there have been continued 902 00:44:37,089 --> 00:44:34,819 sighting the problem is that again this 903 00:44:41,349 --> 00:44:37,099 is where the UFO community makes a 904 00:44:44,920 --> 00:44:41,359 mistake I can list a number of really 905 00:44:47,910 --> 00:44:44,930 critical incidents Bentwaters would be 906 00:44:53,289 --> 00:44:47,920 tops on the list 907 00:44:55,809 --> 00:44:53,299 there's the mounts from base in the book 908 00:44:58,599 --> 00:44:55,819 I go into this ones in the former Soviet 909 00:45:01,089 --> 00:44:58,609 Union where you had you know really 910 00:45:05,260 --> 00:45:01,099 significant interactions with strategic 911 00:45:07,299 --> 00:45:05,270 systems and so the unwashed generally 912 00:45:09,190 --> 00:45:07,309 say well see therefore it must be 913 00:45:11,950 --> 00:45:09,200 important well the idea was that 914 00:45:14,140 --> 00:45:11,960 yeah studies were in fact done but did 915 00:45:17,650 --> 00:45:14,150 not come up with an answer now 916 00:45:18,010 --> 00:45:17,660 when you I take all of these critical 917 00:45:29,920 --> 00:45:18,020 and 918 00:45:32,440 --> 00:45:29,930 pretty rare when you have I'm not 919 00:45:34,500 --> 00:45:32,450 talking about you know somebody taking a 920 00:45:38,530 --> 00:45:34,510 quick picture or something like that but 921 00:45:43,540 --> 00:45:38,540 actual you know interactions they're 922 00:45:45,460 --> 00:45:43,550 pretty damn rare events in fact if 923 00:45:47,260 --> 00:45:45,470 you're listening live out there you can 924 00:45:50,710 --> 00:45:47,270 jump in our chat room and that's at 925 00:45:54,040 --> 00:45:50,720 podcast UFO comm if you'd like to call 926 00:45:56,770 --> 00:45:54,050 and ask a dr. John Alexander question 927 00:46:01,560 --> 00:45:56,780 the phone number is six oh three nine 928 00:46:05,500 --> 00:46:01,570 six seven four oh three oh there I 929 00:46:10,240 --> 00:46:05,510 noticed your email address and that you 930 00:46:12,850 --> 00:46:10,250 had this non-lethal weapon and we have a 931 00:46:14,650 --> 00:46:12,860 question up on the message board so 932 00:46:15,640 --> 00:46:14,660 we're going to skip to that for right 933 00:46:19,570 --> 00:46:15,650 now if that's all right 934 00:46:21,850 --> 00:46:19,580 and they want to know let's see the 935 00:46:24,430 --> 00:46:21,860 non-lethal microwave weapons deployed in 936 00:46:27,580 --> 00:46:24,440 Afghanistan and Iraq on the back of 937 00:46:31,750 --> 00:46:27,590 Jeeps was this technology based on UFO 938 00:46:35,890 --> 00:46:31,760 encounters what's that it was the point 939 00:46:39,550 --> 00:46:35,900 on what this is a question that's up 940 00:46:42,490 --> 00:46:39,560 there it says on Afghanistan and Iraq on 941 00:46:44,920 --> 00:46:42,500 the back of Jeeps is that that with 942 00:46:46,080 --> 00:46:44,930 these this technology is no such thing 943 00:46:50,830 --> 00:46:46,090 okay 944 00:46:55,330 --> 00:46:50,840 the best we had were I mean the V Mads 945 00:46:57,520 --> 00:46:55,340 who became the Active Denial system or 946 00:47:00,099 --> 00:46:57,530 ATS is what came along you're talking 947 00:47:05,080 --> 00:47:00,109 about the what Corp we known as the pain 948 00:47:09,730 --> 00:47:05,090 ray this is a microwave weapon it's 949 00:47:14,440 --> 00:47:09,740 really quite big you see it on Humvees 950 00:47:17,200 --> 00:47:14,450 that's highly optimistic but what it 951 00:47:21,340 --> 00:47:17,210 does is puts out a beam at 93 gigahertz 952 00:47:23,940 --> 00:47:21,350 it will hit the skin penetrates just a 953 00:47:27,670 --> 00:47:23,950 few millimeters but hits the pain 954 00:47:30,460 --> 00:47:27,680 centers and makes you want to go away 955 00:47:31,339 --> 00:47:30,470 very quickly I've been shot by that and 956 00:47:35,579 --> 00:47:31,349 most 957 00:47:38,339 --> 00:47:35,589 lethal weapons that seems like would be 958 00:47:40,260 --> 00:47:38,349 really good they're going to poured it 959 00:47:43,650 --> 00:47:40,270 seems like that would be really good and 960 00:47:47,490 --> 00:47:43,660 the issues they have with pirating open 961 00:47:49,800 --> 00:47:47,500 seas pirates well the problem there and 962 00:47:51,690 --> 00:47:49,810 we looked at this and was really the 963 00:47:54,210 --> 00:47:51,700 nest Academy of science was doing a 964 00:48:00,359 --> 00:47:54,220 study on it for the Navy after the Cole 965 00:48:02,819 --> 00:48:00,369 incident and power becomes the main 966 00:48:06,030 --> 00:48:02,829 issue you need some place with power and 967 00:48:08,640 --> 00:48:06,040 the ships by and large we're not willing 968 00:48:12,359 --> 00:48:08,650 to make the trade-off in what you need 969 00:48:15,900 --> 00:48:12,369 you to relinquish in cubic footage for 970 00:48:21,420 --> 00:48:15,910 the advantage that you might get now we 971 00:48:23,550 --> 00:48:21,430 keep exploring these things my last job 972 00:48:26,849 --> 00:48:23,560 in the military was a director of 973 00:48:29,640 --> 00:48:26,859 advanced systems concepts at Fermilab 974 00:48:32,640 --> 00:48:29,650 rhetorica manned and I had all of the 975 00:48:36,390 --> 00:48:32,650 tactical directed energy which included 976 00:48:39,059 --> 00:48:36,400 lasers and high-power microwaves and 977 00:48:43,190 --> 00:48:39,069 that sort of thing and yeah there's been 978 00:48:45,660 --> 00:48:43,200 some advances but you know I have 979 00:48:47,130 --> 00:48:45,670 admonished some briefer or since then 980 00:48:50,790 --> 00:48:47,140 when they get up and they give these 981 00:48:53,280 --> 00:48:50,800 future concepts briefing and I asked 982 00:48:55,920 --> 00:48:53,290 them I said what what are you talking 983 00:49:00,450 --> 00:48:55,930 about because I gave this same briefing 984 00:49:02,550 --> 00:49:00,460 you know 25 years ago you know here you 985 00:49:05,520 --> 00:49:02,560 are talking about it hundreds of 986 00:49:09,660 --> 00:49:05,530 millions of dollars later and yes 987 00:49:11,700 --> 00:49:09,670 there's been some improvement but have 988 00:49:14,040 --> 00:49:11,710 not seen any breakthrough technology 989 00:49:17,220 --> 00:49:14,050 come along uh-huh 990 00:49:21,079 --> 00:49:17,230 question up on the message board could 991 00:49:24,059 --> 00:49:21,089 you let's see someone wants me to ask if 992 00:49:26,970 --> 00:49:24,069 evidence of government knowledge of UFOs 993 00:49:29,609 --> 00:49:26,980 lies and the following and following the 994 00:49:32,010 --> 00:49:29,619 money trail as you say how can Rumsfeld 995 00:49:34,559 --> 00:49:32,020 announce two point three trillion 996 00:49:36,990 --> 00:49:34,569 missing from the federal budget where 997 00:49:39,870 --> 00:49:37,000 does that money trail go mom sounds that 998 00:49:41,790 --> 00:49:39,880 that money we don't have that money 999 00:49:44,150 --> 00:49:41,800 missing and there's no big pots out 1000 00:49:47,390 --> 00:49:44,160 there yeah 1001 00:49:51,290 --> 00:49:47,400 you can slap around a few million 1002 00:49:54,170 --> 00:49:51,300 dollars but you know that's a popular 1003 00:49:57,800 --> 00:49:54,180 thing as Medicare Rumsfeld just before 1004 00:50:00,380 --> 00:49:57,810 9/11 he was about to take on you know 1005 00:50:03,980 --> 00:50:00,390 the military-industrial complex and 1006 00:50:07,580 --> 00:50:03,990 wanted to really ding the contractors 1007 00:50:12,920 --> 00:50:07,590 and had come up with a trillion dollar 1008 00:50:17,990 --> 00:50:12,930 figure there's no such money missing 1009 00:50:20,510 --> 00:50:18,000 as they say their black budgets yes with 1010 00:50:23,270 --> 00:50:20,520 folks on rely again you get back to lack 1011 00:50:27,020 --> 00:50:23,280 of understanding of the government is 1012 00:50:32,060 --> 00:50:27,030 that there are people who oversee black 1013 00:50:34,040 --> 00:50:32,070 projects the money is finite and 1014 00:50:37,760 --> 00:50:34,050 particularly research and development 1015 00:50:43,430 --> 00:50:37,770 has been cut severely because of the 1016 00:50:47,570 --> 00:50:43,440 ongoing wars and while you know the 1017 00:50:51,440 --> 00:50:47,580 money is finite there's Pierce internal 1018 00:50:56,720 --> 00:50:51,450 competition even with him what you would 1019 00:51:00,260 --> 00:50:56,730 call the black world for money and if he 1020 00:51:04,600 --> 00:51:00,270 got crazy ideas you're probably not 1021 00:51:08,110 --> 00:51:04,610 going to come out with a lot of money 1022 00:51:11,140 --> 00:51:08,120 particularly in the extremely lean 1023 00:51:14,810 --> 00:51:11,150 budgetary constraints that we've had 1024 00:51:22,220 --> 00:51:14,820 further exacerbated by sequester that 1025 00:51:26,300 --> 00:51:22,230 has really really hurt all our D huh I 1026 00:51:29,200 --> 00:51:26,310 want to go back your stand pretty strong 1027 00:51:31,490 --> 00:51:29,210 that you don't think the government is 1028 00:51:34,490 --> 00:51:31,500 we don't think I'm going to back up 1029 00:51:37,370 --> 00:51:34,500 again sure government what is the 1030 00:51:38,900 --> 00:51:37,380 government it is not alright I just tell 1031 00:51:42,230 --> 00:51:38,910 you when I when I was in the Pentagon 1032 00:51:44,840 --> 00:51:42,240 used to run around say you know where's 1033 00:51:46,790 --> 00:51:44,850 this guy Pentagon because there's all 1034 00:51:49,100 --> 00:51:46,800 these things that the Pentagon says this 1035 00:51:51,170 --> 00:51:49,110 and the Pentagon says that the pentagon 1036 00:51:53,990 --> 00:51:51,180 probe will say anything it's a big stone 1037 00:51:57,710 --> 00:51:54,000 building but there are people in there 1038 00:52:03,589 --> 00:52:00,710 so again you were back to this on 1039 00:52:09,080 --> 00:52:03,599 missions on UFOs and totally incompetent 1040 00:52:11,690 --> 00:52:09,090 and everything else but same people okay 1041 00:52:17,630 --> 00:52:11,700 alright let's just say that let's just 1042 00:52:22,400 --> 00:52:17,640 say DARPA or some part of the military I 1043 00:52:24,140 --> 00:52:22,410 would think that if something is in our 1044 00:52:26,420 --> 00:52:24,150 skies and they know that something's in 1045 00:52:29,000 --> 00:52:26,430 our skies but they don't know what it is 1046 00:52:31,670 --> 00:52:29,010 but the thing that gets me is I would 1047 00:52:35,180 --> 00:52:31,680 just think that there would be someone 1048 00:52:36,940 --> 00:52:35,190 really paying attention to that if 1049 00:52:39,050 --> 00:52:36,950 you're lucky you might get some 1050 00:52:41,300 --> 00:52:39,060 individuals who want to pay attention 1051 00:52:44,450 --> 00:52:41,310 but that's not going to be any big 1052 00:52:48,580 --> 00:52:44,460 effort again you're infected remember we 1053 00:52:54,250 --> 00:52:48,590 have been a war constantly since 2001 1054 00:52:58,070 --> 00:52:54,260 spent about three trillion in that so 1055 00:53:01,580 --> 00:52:58,080 what is it that you want them to pay 1056 00:53:04,190 --> 00:53:01,590 attention to that's different from you 1057 00:53:05,599 --> 00:53:04,200 know the war effort what I mean you keep 1058 00:53:07,430 --> 00:53:05,609 hearing you haven't gone to reverse 1059 00:53:09,680 --> 00:53:07,440 engineering but I should think that's a 1060 00:53:12,500 --> 00:53:09,690 topic that will come up and you go oh 1061 00:53:14,630 --> 00:53:12,510 wait a minute let's look at the 1062 00:53:18,380 --> 00:53:14,640 technological advances that we've seen 1063 00:53:22,940 --> 00:53:18,390 and conflict or war those tend to bring 1064 00:53:27,849 --> 00:53:22,950 out technological advances and the best 1065 00:53:30,349 --> 00:53:27,859 we've seen is the f-35 and people are 1066 00:53:34,339 --> 00:53:30,359 worried now about the damn thing can't 1067 00:53:37,160 --> 00:53:34,349 fight after the billions and billions of 1068 00:53:40,060 --> 00:53:37,170 dollars that have been you know put into 1069 00:53:43,550 --> 00:53:40,070 that effort so you don't see anything 1070 00:53:48,200 --> 00:53:43,560 you know we see a really big leap in 1071 00:53:50,540 --> 00:53:48,210 technology again you get back to where 1072 00:53:54,400 --> 00:53:50,550 do you want apply your resources it's a 1073 00:54:00,410 --> 00:53:56,960 maybe you want to keep a finger in there 1074 00:54:04,160 --> 00:54:00,420 somebody it is primarily probably on 1075 00:54:07,760 --> 00:54:04,170 personal interest and I'm sure you know 1076 00:54:11,089 --> 00:54:07,770 as I said there are people inside the 1077 00:54:11,720 --> 00:54:11,099 government who have seen unusual sorts 1078 00:54:14,080 --> 00:54:11,730 of things 1079 00:54:17,810 --> 00:54:14,090 some acknowledged that through their um 1080 00:54:20,870 --> 00:54:17,820 the problem is when you have researched 1081 00:54:23,480 --> 00:54:20,880 them and we can go off on the Bentwaters 1082 00:54:26,210 --> 00:54:23,490 that's one of the you know I think one 1083 00:54:30,770 --> 00:54:26,220 of the best cases and and you still end 1084 00:54:32,950 --> 00:54:30,780 up with you know had no idea what it was 1085 00:54:35,450 --> 00:54:32,960 but something certainly happened there 1086 00:54:37,690 --> 00:54:35,460 yeah someone on the message board wants 1087 00:54:39,590 --> 00:54:37,700 you to describe the government 1088 00:54:44,030 --> 00:54:39,600 what's your description of the 1089 00:54:47,300 --> 00:54:44,040 government I'm not even going to play 1090 00:54:49,310 --> 00:54:47,310 with that and you know on the Google US 1091 00:54:53,240 --> 00:54:49,320 government will tell you the three 1092 00:54:56,000 --> 00:54:53,250 branches and etc etc the one things they 1093 00:54:57,859 --> 00:54:56,010 don't understand is that let's deal with 1094 00:55:00,950 --> 00:54:57,869 the people in the government first of 1095 00:55:03,290 --> 00:55:00,960 all their primary interest is retaining 1096 00:55:06,890 --> 00:55:03,300 their jobs this is certainly true and 1097 00:55:09,980 --> 00:55:06,900 the legislative and generally in the 1098 00:55:12,560 --> 00:55:09,990 executive branch as well so your primary 1099 00:55:16,130 --> 00:55:12,570 focus is on maintaining your job 1100 00:55:19,250 --> 00:55:16,140 the government is has organizations each 1101 00:55:21,520 --> 00:55:19,260 organization has very specific job 1102 00:55:25,490 --> 00:55:21,530 descriptions as to what they're 1103 00:55:29,120 --> 00:55:25,500 responsible for very strict laws and how 1104 00:55:29,630 --> 00:55:29,130 money is spent it cetera it's split 1105 00:55:33,380 --> 00:55:29,640 between 1106 00:55:35,180 --> 00:55:33,390 the executive branch which is you know 1107 00:55:37,550 --> 00:55:35,190 controlling most of the agencies and 1108 00:55:39,880 --> 00:55:37,560 you're talking about and the legislative 1109 00:55:42,680 --> 00:55:39,890 branch was controls the purse strings 1110 00:55:45,500 --> 00:55:42,690 well let me ask you this how important 1111 00:55:49,270 --> 00:55:45,510 do you think UFOs are and finding out 1112 00:55:52,670 --> 00:55:49,280 what they are in the UFO community very 1113 00:55:56,620 --> 00:55:52,680 important to average person it's a whole 1114 00:55:59,859 --> 00:55:56,630 home I asked for such a thing probably 1115 00:56:03,530 --> 00:55:59,869 70% of the population believe in UFOs 1116 00:56:06,080 --> 00:56:03,540 but you ask them to our massive how much 1117 00:56:08,300 --> 00:56:06,090 of your tax dollar would you like spent 1118 00:56:10,880 --> 00:56:08,310 on this or would you be willing to have 1119 00:56:16,040 --> 00:56:10,890 taxes increase to study if the answer is 1120 00:56:20,830 --> 00:56:16,050 solid no I I have to agree with you on 1121 00:56:23,630 --> 00:56:20,840 that that I think that most people 1122 00:56:25,520 --> 00:56:23,640 unlike people that are listening to the 1123 00:56:29,870 --> 00:56:25,530 show and myself 1124 00:56:33,500 --> 00:56:29,880 are like busy with their lives and never 1125 00:56:35,660 --> 00:56:33,510 even really contemplate what's going on 1126 00:56:37,609 --> 00:56:35,670 in the universe or you know it just 1127 00:56:40,970 --> 00:56:37,619 doesn't affect them or they seemingly 1128 00:56:44,240 --> 00:56:40,980 doesn't affect them and we have Wars 1129 00:56:46,460 --> 00:56:44,250 going on that do not affect the American 1130 00:56:48,500 --> 00:56:46,470 public in general other than they pay a 1131 00:56:51,080 --> 00:56:48,510 lot of money for it that's one of the 1132 00:56:53,780 --> 00:56:51,090 Travis Jesus you know you've mentioned 1133 00:56:57,620 --> 00:56:53,790 Iraq and Afghanistan I did make 1134 00:56:59,870 --> 00:56:57,630 Afghanistan early on but less than one 1135 00:57:04,430 --> 00:56:59,880 percent of the American population is 1136 00:57:07,480 --> 00:57:04,440 affected you know by these conflicts and 1137 00:57:11,330 --> 00:57:07,490 so it just totally disconnected 1138 00:57:13,450 --> 00:57:11,340 similarly in the Europa unfortunately 1139 00:57:17,090 --> 00:57:13,460 it's a very incestuous community and 1140 00:57:20,840 --> 00:57:17,100 they drink their own bathwater and 1141 00:57:22,970 --> 00:57:20,850 believe their press press clippings and 1142 00:57:25,520 --> 00:57:22,980 start believing this and bleeding is a 1143 00:57:27,590 --> 00:57:25,530 big deal when you go you know the 1144 00:57:33,970 --> 00:57:27,600 question I have there is compared to 1145 00:57:37,010 --> 00:57:33,980 what compared to war or terrorism or 1146 00:57:40,460 --> 00:57:37,020 healthcare system or whatnot it just 1147 00:57:45,440 --> 00:57:40,470 doesn't make the cut well I see that 1148 00:57:47,920 --> 00:57:45,450 you're friends with John Mack and so 1149 00:57:52,099 --> 00:57:47,930 what do you what do you think about the 1150 00:57:55,340 --> 00:57:52,109 abduction side of this whole thing Oh 1151 00:57:57,740 --> 00:57:55,350 straight backs John was a great guy good 1152 00:58:06,680 --> 00:57:57,750 friend unfortunately but an untimely 1153 00:58:11,120 --> 00:58:06,690 demise in UK again I'll step back to 1154 00:58:14,260 --> 00:58:11,130 what I mentioned before interactions 1155 00:58:16,760 --> 00:58:14,270 between humans and sentient nonhumans 1156 00:58:20,780 --> 00:58:16,770 including things that sound a lot like 1157 00:58:24,650 --> 00:58:20,790 abductions the issue there is that the 1158 00:58:25,940 --> 00:58:24,660 UFO abduction is a fairly new wrinkle to 1159 00:58:29,240 --> 00:58:25,950 a very old story 1160 00:58:30,890 --> 00:58:29,250 I think things happen understand that 1161 00:58:33,380 --> 00:58:30,900 but let's understand some of these 1162 00:58:37,220 --> 00:58:33,390 incidents are certainly real if I'm not 1163 00:58:39,559 --> 00:58:37,230 suggesting at all that is not real but 1164 00:58:42,109 --> 00:58:39,569 I'm not convinced that you know 1165 00:58:45,229 --> 00:58:42,119 little grey guys from Zeta Reticuli you 1166 00:58:48,739 --> 00:58:45,239 know coming down to snatch folks up now 1167 00:58:54,519 --> 00:58:48,749 have you ever really investigated your 1168 00:58:59,059 --> 00:58:56,959 we mentioned Bentwaters a couple of 1169 00:59:01,809 --> 00:58:59,069 times that's something is that is that a 1170 00:59:04,699 --> 00:59:01,819 case that you really looked into deeply 1171 00:59:07,519 --> 00:59:04,709 well I have talked to most of the 1172 00:59:09,019 --> 00:59:07,529 principals on that yes and I think it's 1173 00:59:13,489 --> 00:59:09,029 one of the strongest ones you end up 1174 00:59:17,479 --> 00:59:13,499 with about sixty identifiable witnesses 1175 00:59:21,140 --> 00:59:17,489 most of them in the PRP well you have 1176 00:59:25,120 --> 00:59:21,150 the physical evidence and certainly seen 1177 00:59:28,309 --> 00:59:25,130 the plaster casts and the recordings and 1178 00:59:30,140 --> 00:59:28,319 when I first talked to Jim Penniston and 1179 00:59:33,499 --> 00:59:30,150 you know he goes oh you mean the one I 1180 00:59:37,189 --> 00:59:33,509 touched yeah I believe he walked up and 1181 00:59:39,890 --> 00:59:37,199 touched something so and more and more 1182 00:59:43,969 --> 00:59:39,900 data you know have come out 1183 00:59:46,099 --> 00:59:43,979 I think they recently found the radar 1184 00:59:50,630 --> 00:59:46,109 corroboration that something was in the 1185 00:59:53,569 --> 00:59:50,640 area by the way that gets to some of the 1186 00:59:58,099 --> 00:59:53,579 most interesting technical aspects about 1187 01:00:01,819 --> 00:59:58,109 UFOs is that you have them on radar 1188 01:00:05,029 --> 01:00:01,829 moving very very fast making you know 1189 01:00:06,650 --> 01:00:05,039 high-speed turns that are basically it 1190 01:00:10,759 --> 01:00:06,660 would be physically impossible to 1191 01:00:14,029 --> 01:00:10,769 survive yet these things happen and at 1192 01:00:17,589 --> 01:00:14,039 other times you've got sightings of 1193 01:00:22,519 --> 01:00:17,599 things we have you know visual visible 1194 01:00:24,170 --> 01:00:22,529 confirmation and no correlating radar 1195 01:00:30,380 --> 01:00:24,180 even though you would expect them to 1196 01:00:32,979 --> 01:00:30,390 have such this gets back to them bottom 1197 01:00:36,259 --> 01:00:32,989 line is it it is terribly terribly 1198 01:00:38,660 --> 01:00:36,269 complex whatever we're dealing with now 1199 01:00:42,680 --> 01:00:38,670 the one thing about the Rendlesham 1200 01:00:47,059 --> 01:00:42,690 forest incident is that there's there's 1201 01:00:50,449 --> 01:00:47,069 a lot of controversy between you know 1202 01:00:53,089 --> 01:00:50,459 people involved you know and I've had I 1203 01:00:53,450 --> 01:00:53,099 had Charles Hall died I met him and he 1204 01:00:57,290 --> 01:00:53,460 was 1205 01:01:00,380 --> 01:00:57,300 on this show with John Burroughs there's 1206 01:01:04,190 --> 01:01:00,390 a lot of you know conflicts between a 1207 01:01:07,460 --> 01:01:04,200 number of the people in that this more 1208 01:01:09,980 --> 01:01:07,470 personal personality driven unknown 1209 01:01:12,560 --> 01:01:09,990 Chuck for years and Eppley Keys pretty 1210 01:01:15,290 --> 01:01:12,570 straightforward on them they know 1211 01:01:19,640 --> 01:01:15,300 Penniston talk to Burl's talk to a 1212 01:01:25,270 --> 01:01:19,650 number of others that were more of a you 1213 01:01:28,250 --> 01:01:25,280 know on the side you know this was a 1214 01:01:32,330 --> 01:01:28,260 again the UFO community thinks that this 1215 01:01:35,120 --> 01:01:32,340 was a good deal for Chuck got him 1216 01:01:37,460 --> 01:01:35,130 promoted when in fact it was you know it 1217 01:01:41,420 --> 01:01:37,470 almost got him derailed he was already 1218 01:01:44,690 --> 01:01:41,430 on the fast track to Colonel and this 1219 01:01:46,580 --> 01:01:44,700 you know being associated with UFOs and 1220 01:01:48,590 --> 01:01:46,590 the military is generally not a good 1221 01:01:51,500 --> 01:01:48,600 thing and he will tell you that a number 1222 01:01:56,920 --> 01:01:51,510 of his people suffered from a career 1223 01:02:00,770 --> 01:01:56,930 perspective just because of any 1224 01:02:02,570 --> 01:02:00,780 relationship to the the incident what 1225 01:02:05,150 --> 01:02:02,580 would you say to the skeptic out there 1226 01:02:07,310 --> 01:02:05,160 you hear about all the lighthouse it was 1227 01:02:10,760 --> 01:02:07,320 just the lighthouse light Sandoval 1228 01:02:13,460 --> 01:02:10,770 ourselves yes and one of the things they 1229 01:02:15,740 --> 01:02:13,470 did shut up forget there was one program 1230 01:02:18,320 --> 01:02:15,750 that was done where they took the people 1231 01:02:22,040 --> 01:02:18,330 back there and they went to the actual 1232 01:02:24,260 --> 01:02:22,050 site and what they said is you cannot 1233 01:02:28,580 --> 01:02:24,270 see the lighthouse where the incident 1234 01:02:32,660 --> 01:02:28,590 took place periodicity notwithstanding 1235 01:02:34,810 --> 01:02:32,670 on the light that that the lighthouse 1236 01:02:37,370 --> 01:02:34,820 certainly didn't come up and you know 1237 01:02:39,830 --> 01:02:37,380 dent put dents on the ground and 1238 01:02:43,700 --> 01:02:39,840 radiation in the background well another 1239 01:02:47,600 --> 01:02:43,710 thing that's not as well known about the 1240 01:02:50,890 --> 01:02:47,610 case is we talk about it as two or three 1241 01:02:54,110 --> 01:02:50,900 incidents that happened December 1980 1242 01:02:58,340 --> 01:02:54,120 reality is weird stuff happened in that 1243 01:03:04,000 --> 01:02:58,350 area kind of forever and has even 1244 01:03:06,530 --> 01:03:04,010 continued after the base closed right so 1245 01:03:08,240 --> 01:03:06,540 we tend to try to listen 1246 01:03:13,310 --> 01:03:08,250 problem.the studying when you try to 1247 01:03:16,790 --> 01:03:13,320 isolate specific aspects of it and not 1248 01:03:19,640 --> 01:03:16,800 look at it in the larger context that's 1249 01:03:23,150 --> 01:03:19,650 right I believe when I spoke with the 1250 01:03:24,920 --> 01:03:23,160 Chuck he mentioned that things were 1251 01:03:28,900 --> 01:03:24,930 actually there was a sighting actually I 1252 01:03:35,410 --> 01:03:28,910 think from last year at some point still 1253 01:03:43,370 --> 01:03:38,720 even weirder things were going on all 1254 01:03:47,540 --> 01:03:43,380 along and it was far more than just the 1255 01:03:51,110 --> 01:03:47,550 two or three incidents that get written 1256 01:03:54,260 --> 01:03:51,120 above right okay that's it for the first 1257 01:03:56,930 --> 01:03:54,270 hour and hang in for this quick music 1258 01:04:00,320 --> 01:03:56,940 break we'll be right back to hear John 1259 01:04:02,210 --> 01:04:00,330 talk about Roswell skinwalker ranch and 1260 01:04:03,590 --> 01:04:02,220 more if you're listening this fire 1261 01:04:44,210 --> 01:04:03,600 you're a supporter and I want to thank 1262 01:04:50,400 --> 01:04:47,960 by the way the music for this show is 1263 01:04:53,430 --> 01:04:50,410 created by Carrie Lloyd Whitehouse 1264 01:04:56,730 --> 01:04:53,440 season Ireland he makes music for 1265 01:04:59,690 --> 01:04:56,740 several movies some blockbuster movies 1266 01:05:03,329 --> 01:04:59,700 as well and he created an album 1267 01:05:05,609 --> 01:05:03,339 dedicated it to our past astronomer who 1268 01:05:09,210 --> 01:05:05,619 passed away recently 1269 01:05:11,460 --> 01:05:09,220 Andy Fleming and so there's a banner up 1270 01:05:13,710 --> 01:05:11,470 on podcast UFO on the sidebar and he 1271 01:05:15,870 --> 01:05:13,720 said anyone can download that music is 1272 01:05:18,960 --> 01:05:15,880 for free you can have it so that's right 1273 01:05:24,390 --> 01:05:18,970 on our website and Thank You Kerry for 1274 01:05:26,250 --> 01:05:24,400 that all right so John getting back to I 1275 01:05:29,849 --> 01:05:26,260 guess we're pretty much done on 1276 01:05:34,559 --> 01:05:29,859 Rendlesham forest I true I too think 1277 01:05:39,870 --> 01:05:34,569 it's truly in the top five cases that I 1278 01:05:42,780 --> 01:05:39,880 can think of and now I understand and I 1279 01:05:46,470 --> 01:05:42,790 know there's going to be some as Michael 1280 01:05:48,150 --> 01:05:46,480 who filled in for me last week said 1281 01:05:52,980 --> 01:05:48,160 there's going to be some heads exploding 1282 01:05:54,630 --> 01:05:52,990 but I understand you're not you don't 1283 01:06:00,599 --> 01:05:54,640 have a lot of faith in the Roswell 1284 01:06:06,059 --> 01:06:00,609 incident well the problem of Roswell is 1285 01:06:08,849 --> 01:06:06,069 the pieces never all quite fit I do tend 1286 01:06:11,370 --> 01:06:08,859 to come down against Roswell having said 1287 01:06:16,500 --> 01:06:11,380 that I've got some friends and I highly 1288 01:06:19,140 --> 01:06:16,510 respect to say that I'm wrong I happen 1289 01:06:23,039 --> 01:06:19,150 to think that it probably was something 1290 01:06:25,589 --> 01:06:23,049 of ours I I was kind of surprised it was 1291 01:06:32,339 --> 01:06:25,599 actually one of the programs that bill 1292 01:06:35,190 --> 01:06:32,349 burns dead and brought in when Jesse Jr 1293 01:06:38,640 --> 01:06:35,200 was still alive and there was a motor 1294 01:06:42,480 --> 01:06:38,650 sergeant they put out several thin films 1295 01:06:45,180 --> 01:06:42,490 and asked them to come in and say do you 1296 01:06:47,640 --> 01:06:45,190 see the material here that you had 1297 01:06:50,849 --> 01:06:47,650 handled years before and I absolutely 1298 01:06:53,520 --> 01:06:50,859 think that hey something did happen and 1299 01:06:54,240 --> 01:06:53,530 that Jesse Jr was absolutely 1300 01:06:56,910 --> 01:06:54,250 straight-arrow 1301 01:06:59,540 --> 01:06:56,920 on one of the few people who said 1302 01:07:03,450 --> 01:06:59,550 exactly what he knew and didn't 1303 01:07:06,780 --> 01:07:03,460 extrapolate but they both went in and 1304 01:07:11,580 --> 01:07:06,790 pointed to the same material and it did 1305 01:07:15,600 --> 01:07:11,590 exist at that time and it was exactly 1306 01:07:19,500 --> 01:07:15,610 what was needed for the mission that was 1307 01:07:23,760 --> 01:07:19,510 described so are you talking about that 1308 01:07:24,620 --> 01:07:23,770 the Mogul well something some of that 1309 01:07:29,250 --> 01:07:24,630 yeah 1310 01:07:34,800 --> 01:07:29,260 so this things don't when when someone 1311 01:07:36,990 --> 01:07:34,810 is taking apart the Roswell case there's 1312 01:07:40,560 --> 01:07:37,000 some things that don't fit either and 1313 01:07:43,620 --> 01:07:40,570 that is what first of all I've heard 1314 01:07:46,830 --> 01:07:43,630 different people's ideas on why the Army 1315 01:07:49,260 --> 01:07:46,840 Air Force would say that they recovered 1316 01:07:51,960 --> 01:07:49,270 a disk so first of all let's hear what 1317 01:07:58,020 --> 01:07:51,970 your thoughts are on why they would say 1318 01:08:01,410 --> 01:07:58,030 that oh they said they had the material 1319 01:08:03,090 --> 01:08:01,420 as opposed to a disc at number at the 1320 01:08:08,430 --> 01:08:03,100 time this funny thing that's interesting 1321 01:08:14,460 --> 01:08:08,440 Roswell was not a big deal in 1947 you 1322 01:08:17,790 --> 01:08:14,470 know it wasn't until more bullets came 1323 01:08:23,400 --> 01:08:17,800 forward with books what 20 years later 1324 01:08:26,340 --> 01:08:23,410 that it picked up the scheme again no I 1325 01:08:30,660 --> 01:08:26,350 I had people again a highly respect who 1326 01:08:33,420 --> 01:08:30,670 knew about the project of the material 1327 01:08:34,070 --> 01:08:33,430 that was picked up is exactly what was 1328 01:08:38,880 --> 01:08:34,080 needed 1329 01:08:41,550 --> 01:08:38,890 there's an interesting web on telling 1330 01:08:47,880 --> 01:08:41,560 the guy's name now there's a professor 1331 01:08:50,940 --> 01:08:47,890 at UC Berkeley who was involved in those 1332 01:08:56,430 --> 01:08:50,950 days and describes this in exquisite 1333 01:08:57,120 --> 01:08:56,440 detail one of the things I learned from 1334 01:09:00,960 --> 01:08:57,130 the process 1335 01:09:04,410 --> 01:09:00,970 I hadn't heard was that you got to 1336 01:09:10,050 --> 01:09:04,420 remember the context this was the bad 1337 01:09:13,290 --> 01:09:10,060 old days 47 we had popped hydrogen bombs 1338 01:09:17,430 --> 01:09:13,300 nobody else have but we knew the Soviet 1339 01:09:19,170 --> 01:09:17,440 Union was about to do so once that 1340 01:09:20,760 --> 01:09:19,180 happened there was an absolute 1341 01:09:27,660 --> 01:09:20,770 GameChanger from a geopolitical 1342 01:09:29,570 --> 01:09:27,670 standpoint and so knowing when they you 1343 01:09:32,730 --> 01:09:29,580 know touched off the first nuke was 1344 01:09:34,770 --> 01:09:32,740 absolutely critical there were some 1345 01:09:38,400 --> 01:09:34,780 things that were learned from World War 1346 01:09:42,170 --> 01:09:38,410 two this is the piece and I hadn't heard 1347 01:09:45,809 --> 01:09:42,180 about pilots flying over the Pacific 1348 01:09:48,690 --> 01:09:45,819 were given little balls and said if you 1349 01:09:51,510 --> 01:09:48,700 get shot down what you do is you pull a 1350 01:09:54,810 --> 01:09:51,520 pin on this thing and drop it into the 1351 01:09:55,800 --> 01:09:54,820 ocean if you haven't been picked up in 1352 01:09:59,310 --> 01:09:55,810 three days 1353 01:10:00,990 --> 01:09:59,320 pull the pin drop the second one and it 1354 01:10:04,260 --> 01:10:01,000 turns out there were certain acoustic 1355 01:10:05,760 --> 01:10:04,270 channels that we're in the water and so 1356 01:10:09,210 --> 01:10:05,770 what we would do is go and park 1357 01:10:11,160 --> 01:10:09,220 submarines in strategic areas near where 1358 01:10:14,730 --> 01:10:11,170 the flight pattern that was going to be 1359 01:10:17,160 --> 01:10:14,740 and they would hear the ping go up and 1360 01:10:19,350 --> 01:10:17,170 pick up the pilot well it turns out the 1361 01:10:21,630 --> 01:10:19,360 same things occur in the stratosphere 1362 01:10:26,520 --> 01:10:21,640 and what they were doing was taking 1363 01:10:31,230 --> 01:10:26,530 advantage of that now later our seismic 1364 01:10:34,410 --> 01:10:31,240 sensors became much more sophisticated 1365 01:10:37,920 --> 01:10:34,420 and able to do the sighting and we went 1366 01:10:40,950 --> 01:10:37,930 to you know relying on seismic sensors 1367 01:10:44,460 --> 01:10:40,960 as opposed to high-altitude acoustic 1368 01:10:47,130 --> 01:10:44,470 sensors but the material needed had to 1369 01:10:51,630 --> 01:10:47,140 be certain size shape and whatnot and a 1370 01:10:54,150 --> 01:10:51,640 lot of folks aren't aware but between 60 1371 01:10:57,630 --> 01:10:54,160 and 80 thousand feet there's horrendous 1372 01:10:59,750 --> 01:10:57,640 crosswinds and so what you needed was 1373 01:11:02,460 --> 01:10:59,760 material that could withstand 1374 01:11:05,330 --> 01:11:02,470 deformation and return to its original 1375 01:11:09,750 --> 01:11:05,340 configuration and that's exactly the 1376 01:11:13,620 --> 01:11:09,760 material that was picked up well in that 1377 01:11:15,810 --> 01:11:13,630 if that's the case why would so many 1378 01:11:18,930 --> 01:11:15,820 well this couple things why would so 1379 01:11:21,240 --> 01:11:18,940 many people make such a big deal about 1380 01:11:24,380 --> 01:11:21,250 it and why would they pick up their 1381 01:11:27,360 --> 01:11:24,390 reason that my point was they did 1382 01:11:29,130 --> 01:11:27,370 nobody raised their people with so many 1383 01:11:31,410 --> 01:11:29,140 years later all right 1384 01:11:34,020 --> 01:11:31,420 so many years later people are saying 1385 01:11:35,790 --> 01:11:34,030 they never saw anything like say the 1386 01:11:37,830 --> 01:11:35,800 material that these they crunched up in 1387 01:11:41,120 --> 01:11:37,840 their hands and well they did the people 1388 01:11:46,230 --> 01:11:41,130 that we know had their hands on it you 1389 01:11:50,790 --> 01:11:46,240 know did say this is either what I saw 1390 01:11:54,150 --> 01:11:50,800 very similar to it okay we have a lot of 1391 01:11:57,230 --> 01:11:54,160 people typing madly on the the town the 1392 01:12:00,870 --> 01:11:57,240 chatroom that I can't I can't 1393 01:12:03,210 --> 01:12:00,880 because we in trouble yeah but anyone is 1394 01:12:04,380 --> 01:12:03,220 welcome on the chatroom because I'm not 1395 01:12:06,780 --> 01:12:04,390 going to be able to read your questions 1396 01:12:10,440 --> 01:12:06,790 you're going so fast there please call 1397 01:12:14,130 --> 01:12:10,450 in at 6:03 967 403 Oh 1398 01:12:15,690 --> 01:12:14,140 and have a discussion with the dr. John 1399 01:12:17,280 --> 01:12:15,700 Alexander about Roswell if you'd like 1400 01:12:20,460 --> 01:12:17,290 while we're talking about it one of the 1401 01:12:24,090 --> 01:12:20,470 things that also comes to mind is why 1402 01:12:26,760 --> 01:12:24,100 would they fly the material to write in 1403 01:12:29,040 --> 01:12:26,770 the first place why would it be that 1404 01:12:31,170 --> 01:12:29,050 important if the material was 1405 01:12:34,340 --> 01:12:31,180 conventional to other weather balloons 1406 01:12:37,700 --> 01:12:34,350 and other marine animal not conventional 1407 01:12:40,350 --> 01:12:37,710 very businesses ultra ultra sensitive 1408 01:12:45,720 --> 01:12:40,360 one of the things where I totally 1409 01:12:48,600 --> 01:12:45,730 disagree with Jesse Marcel senior and 1410 01:12:51,300 --> 01:12:48,610 his interviews he said he was the Gd - 1411 01:12:54,300 --> 01:12:51,310 or the intelligence officer at Roswell 1412 01:12:55,770 --> 01:12:54,310 Army Airfield and therefore he knew 1413 01:12:58,800 --> 01:12:55,780 everything it was going on 1414 01:13:02,850 --> 01:12:58,810 that is just utter nonsense 1415 01:13:04,320 --> 01:13:02,860 this was you know he talked about a boat 1416 01:13:07,890 --> 01:13:04,330 top secret remember we were talking 1417 01:13:11,420 --> 01:13:07,900 about looking for the potential 1418 01:13:15,990 --> 01:13:11,430 game-changer in all the existing 1419 01:13:18,870 --> 01:13:16,000 geopolitical situation at the time well 1420 01:13:20,640 --> 01:13:18,880 no they didn't know and I do think that 1421 01:13:25,830 --> 01:13:20,650 one of the things that comes up as the 1422 01:13:27,570 --> 01:13:25,840 material being switched at Fort Worth 1423 01:13:31,500 --> 01:13:27,580 and I think that's absolutely what 1424 01:13:33,690 --> 01:13:31,510 happened and the reason was that by this 1425 01:13:37,180 --> 01:13:33,700 time people were on to what had happened 1426 01:13:40,959 --> 01:13:37,190 and that they knew the Soviets with 1427 01:13:44,320 --> 01:13:40,969 watching television and did not want 1428 01:13:47,920 --> 01:13:44,330 them to see what the real material was 1429 01:13:52,030 --> 01:13:47,930 on I'm convinced that a switch did take 1430 01:13:56,590 --> 01:13:52,040 place wasn't there these mobile balloons 1431 01:13:59,350 --> 01:13:56,600 weren't they pictured in newspapers let 1432 01:14:03,610 --> 01:13:59,360 them know that didn't come along until 1433 01:14:06,689 --> 01:14:03,620 many many years later alright well let's 1434 01:14:10,360 --> 01:14:06,699 talk about the people the witnesses that 1435 01:14:12,729 --> 01:14:10,370 there's like Kevin Randle who I actually 1436 01:14:17,610 --> 01:14:12,739 respect him a lot I think he's a very 1437 01:14:20,290 --> 01:14:17,620 guy we agree to disagree we can have 1438 01:14:24,810 --> 01:14:20,300 life with Sam Friedman and I know you 1439 01:14:28,780 --> 01:14:24,820 know we we have respectable the hill 1440 01:14:34,420 --> 01:14:28,790 disagreement on the facts and it I know 1441 01:14:36,160 --> 01:14:34,430 he's interviewed a lot of people it is 1442 01:14:39,400 --> 01:14:36,170 it for saying how many of them did not 1443 01:14:42,430 --> 01:14:39,410 come forward until because they many 1444 01:14:45,400 --> 01:14:42,440 many years later well in a way one of 1445 01:14:48,189 --> 01:14:45,410 the things I do think is important I do 1446 01:14:50,920 --> 01:14:48,199 believe that a an incident happened and 1447 01:14:54,760 --> 01:14:50,930 B that the cover-up was very 1448 01:14:58,350 --> 01:14:54,770 heavy-handed and when the folks went in 1449 01:15:01,420 --> 01:14:58,360 and absolutely were threatened and 1450 01:15:03,870 --> 01:15:01,430 whatever that was almost when hazel 1451 01:15:08,770 --> 01:15:03,880 O'Leary started truth and reconciliation 1452 01:15:10,720 --> 01:15:08,780 and they're like every in all of the 1453 01:15:13,330 --> 01:15:10,730 interview started with it was a 1454 01:15:17,410 --> 01:15:13,340 different time and I think one of the 1455 01:15:19,420 --> 01:15:17,420 problems not sure how old you are but if 1456 01:15:23,260 --> 01:15:19,430 you remember Duck and Cover and these 1457 01:15:27,250 --> 01:15:23,270 sorts of things people have today have 1458 01:15:27,700 --> 01:15:27,260 no concept of what the Cold War was like 1459 01:15:31,180 --> 01:15:27,710 and 1460 01:15:33,160 --> 01:15:31,190 we honestly believe that you know there 1461 01:15:38,350 --> 01:15:33,170 was an impending nuclear strike coming 1462 01:15:41,380 --> 01:15:38,360 at any you know any minute and it really 1463 01:15:43,660 --> 01:15:41,390 was a totally different time in the 1464 01:15:46,270 --> 01:15:43,670 world hard to imagine in today's 1465 01:15:47,620 --> 01:15:46,280 environment yeah I remember hiding under 1466 01:15:49,750 --> 01:15:47,630 my desk you know that was one of the 1467 01:15:51,129 --> 01:15:49,760 things we had to do is crawl under our 1468 01:15:54,040 --> 01:15:51,139 desks like would be 1469 01:15:54,549 --> 01:15:54,050 saved from a nuclear bomb yeah under the 1470 01:15:55,959 --> 01:15:54,559 desk 1471 01:16:02,679 --> 01:15:55,969 what that would have done a lot of good 1472 01:16:05,350 --> 01:16:02,689 yeah yeah so alright I had a train of 1473 01:16:07,389 --> 01:16:05,360 thought here as far as some so the 1474 01:16:11,469 --> 01:16:07,399 material was flown what about the people 1475 01:16:13,739 --> 01:16:11,479 the many people and you just said right 1476 01:16:18,580 --> 01:16:13,749 there that there was a heavy-handed 1477 01:16:20,290 --> 01:16:18,590 threats going on there so maybe maybe 1478 01:16:21,819 --> 01:16:20,300 that's why people didn't talk about it 1479 01:16:26,109 --> 01:16:21,829 for years and they felt more comfortable 1480 01:16:28,330 --> 01:16:26,119 30 and there were very few with these or 1481 01:16:31,989 --> 01:16:28,340 firsthand almost all of them are 1482 01:16:34,089 --> 01:16:31,999 secondhand witnesses at best and what 1483 01:16:37,540 --> 01:16:34,099 about the bodies do you think that was 1484 01:16:40,149 --> 01:16:37,550 all the desirable I do not believe the 1485 01:16:42,639 --> 01:16:40,159 bodies you know and I've been talking 1486 01:16:46,389 --> 01:16:42,649 I've been told my friends I respect that 1487 01:16:48,969 --> 01:16:46,399 that's wrong but I I don't see bodies 1488 01:16:52,959 --> 01:16:48,979 they didn't enter the picture until much 1489 01:16:57,189 --> 01:16:52,969 later the whole mortuary story and all 1490 01:17:00,459 --> 01:16:57,199 valve in a geological college group that 1491 01:17:05,739 --> 01:17:00,469 supposedly yeah these new groups kept 1492 01:17:08,709 --> 01:17:05,749 popping up but it was Elm you didn't 1493 01:17:12,689 --> 01:17:08,719 hear any of that early on well one of 1494 01:17:15,879 --> 01:17:12,699 the things I think is something that 1495 01:17:18,509 --> 01:17:15,889 shouldn't be discounted quickly as the 1496 01:17:20,969 --> 01:17:18,519 woman in Florida that had the death bed 1497 01:17:24,159 --> 01:17:20,979 basically she was honored at bit and 1498 01:17:27,339 --> 01:17:24,169 said you know she wanted to talk to her 1499 01:17:29,500 --> 01:17:27,349 hospice worker or whoever it was about 1500 01:17:31,179 --> 01:17:29,510 seeing the bodies and being part of that 1501 01:17:34,689 --> 01:17:31,189 group and keeping it quiet all those 1502 01:17:38,500 --> 01:17:34,699 years you know to me that's I have no 1503 01:17:40,089 --> 01:17:38,510 data at all though that's up I can't 1504 01:17:42,339 --> 01:17:40,099 remember if it was I don't think it was 1505 01:17:45,159 --> 01:17:42,349 Kevin Randall I spoke to but I believe 1506 01:17:49,600 --> 01:17:45,169 it might have been the other people 1507 01:17:51,909 --> 01:17:49,610 involved in that so if you're on the 1508 01:17:54,279 --> 01:17:51,919 message board it's going pretty fast 1509 01:17:56,109 --> 01:17:54,289 here so if anyone wants a specific 1510 01:17:59,589 --> 01:17:56,119 question please type it as a question 1511 01:18:01,149 --> 01:17:59,599 and I'll pass it along to we're 1512 01:18:04,480 --> 01:18:01,159 listening right now to John Alexander 1513 01:18:07,990 --> 01:18:04,490 and the phone line is open 1514 01:18:16,200 --> 01:18:08,000 no one's dared to call you John and it's 1515 01:18:20,050 --> 01:18:16,210 6:03 967 403 oh that we bite yeah so 1516 01:18:22,990 --> 01:18:20,060 alright Roswell I think myself you know 1517 01:18:24,580 --> 01:18:23,000 I'm on on the other side of the fence 1518 01:18:28,720 --> 01:18:24,590 from you I just think there's too many 1519 01:18:31,030 --> 01:18:28,730 things I know a lot of times like a myth 1520 01:18:34,950 --> 01:18:31,040 will become fact because it's carried on 1521 01:18:36,910 --> 01:18:34,960 and retold many times for instance 1522 01:18:39,250 --> 01:18:36,920 Alexander the Great let's just say 1523 01:18:41,880 --> 01:18:39,260 Alexander the Great had a UFO sighting 1524 01:18:46,870 --> 01:18:41,890 well right you look back there's no 1525 01:18:48,040 --> 01:18:46,880 other you go before 1959 before a book 1526 01:18:50,050 --> 01:18:48,050 was written about that and there's 1527 01:18:53,590 --> 01:18:50,060 absolutely nothing out there so I 1528 01:18:56,350 --> 01:18:53,600 understand how these myths can get 1529 01:19:01,930 --> 01:18:56,360 carried on and there is a lot of myth 1530 01:19:04,780 --> 01:19:01,940 that has kind of coagulated with Roswell 1531 01:19:09,760 --> 01:19:04,790 and you know people you know dressing up 1532 01:19:13,150 --> 01:19:09,770 they actually wrote to that issue and I 1533 01:19:16,090 --> 01:19:13,160 forget I was published in with gufo 1534 01:19:19,660 --> 01:19:16,100 reporter or some that to look up and see 1535 01:19:22,180 --> 01:19:19,670 where it was published but in all 1536 01:19:25,450 --> 01:19:22,190 phenomena one of the things that I have 1537 01:19:28,720 --> 01:19:25,460 found I developed the whole model based 1538 01:19:32,710 --> 01:19:28,730 on this and what you start with 1539 01:19:35,770 --> 01:19:32,720 like with Roswell or and well Kent 1540 01:19:37,540 --> 01:19:35,780 Arnold and 47 you got a few sightings 1541 01:19:39,400 --> 01:19:37,550 and then you go forward you get more and 1542 01:19:41,980 --> 01:19:39,410 more sighting then you do some studies 1543 01:19:44,350 --> 01:19:41,990 and then you go forward and time and you 1544 01:19:46,810 --> 01:19:44,360 study then you do studies of studies and 1545 01:19:49,240 --> 01:19:46,820 try to aggregate and then at some 1546 01:19:52,330 --> 01:19:49,250 perspectives point in time you do a 1547 01:19:54,310 --> 01:19:52,340 historical perspective and the problem 1548 01:19:56,080 --> 01:19:54,320 with a historical perspective is when 1549 01:19:59,830 --> 01:19:56,090 you reach back you find out the 1550 01:20:02,920 --> 01:19:59,840 phenomena was there long before you 1551 01:20:07,960 --> 01:20:02,930 thought it was it just wasn't recognized 1552 01:20:12,370 --> 01:20:07,970 as such there are plenty of jacque de 1553 01:20:14,729 --> 01:20:12,380 ley did a book fairly recently and i 1554 01:20:17,580 --> 01:20:14,739 mean they went back 3,000 years 1555 01:20:20,879 --> 01:20:17,590 you know of sightings and yet everybody 1556 01:20:23,700 --> 01:20:20,889 wants to start you know the modern 1557 01:20:30,390 --> 01:20:23,710 mythology if you will starts with Kent 1558 01:20:33,060 --> 01:20:30,400 Arnold in summer 47 yes I actually spoke 1559 01:20:38,239 --> 01:20:33,070 with I had a little bit of a debate with 1560 01:20:41,040 --> 01:20:38,249 a doctor step show stock from SETI and 1561 01:20:45,569 --> 01:20:41,050 uh yeah that's I always say his name Ron 1562 01:20:49,200 --> 01:20:45,579 and he he said of the UFO phenomenon 1563 01:20:52,049 --> 01:20:49,210 started in 1947 that's just you know his 1564 01:20:55,290 --> 01:20:52,059 belief a lot of people believe that you 1565 01:20:58,950 --> 01:20:55,300 know that that's it and so Teddy would 1566 01:21:01,649 --> 01:20:58,960 be scared to death if anything really 1567 01:21:04,080 --> 01:21:01,659 they turned up anything real I know what 1568 01:21:06,359 --> 01:21:04,090 they say but I think this is what they 1569 01:21:09,330 --> 01:21:06,369 say it would just scare the crap out of 1570 01:21:12,299 --> 01:21:09,340 them are you saying a signal is that 1571 01:21:16,410 --> 01:21:12,309 what you're saying or yeah the SETI 1572 01:21:23,669 --> 01:21:16,420 program I mean it is basically designed 1573 01:21:25,259 --> 01:21:23,679 for failure ha it I I have I have to 1574 01:21:27,959 --> 01:21:25,269 agree with you on that for the most part 1575 01:21:31,080 --> 01:21:27,969 because of what they're listening for 1576 01:21:35,430 --> 01:21:31,090 could be ancient technology to an 1577 01:21:37,489 --> 01:21:35,440 advanced civilization yeah I had Edward 1578 01:21:40,049 --> 01:21:37,499 Teller and we talked about it and said 1579 01:21:43,790 --> 01:21:40,059 hey they're looking in the wrong place 1580 01:21:46,950 --> 01:21:43,800 and B it's like you know looking out 1581 01:21:51,029 --> 01:21:46,960 basically using a straw explore the 1582 01:21:54,569 --> 01:21:51,039 universe and and we have a problem 1583 01:21:57,290 --> 01:21:54,579 I give I'm not going to get into the 1584 01:22:02,040 --> 01:21:57,300 other topics I've been involved with but 1585 01:22:04,669 --> 01:22:02,050 you know I I have hard evidence of 1586 01:22:07,140 --> 01:22:04,679 various phenomena that occurred in other 1587 01:22:09,750 --> 01:22:07,150 the other domain of the parts of the 1588 01:22:12,600 --> 01:22:09,760 world and the evidence in favor you know 1589 01:22:15,959 --> 01:22:12,610 physical evidence supporting these 1590 01:22:18,270 --> 01:22:15,969 Lamarr just overwhelming friend of mine 1591 01:22:20,609 --> 01:22:18,280 said if psy was a crime it would be 1592 01:22:21,649 --> 01:22:20,619 convicted you know you can stand up in a 1593 01:22:27,239 --> 01:22:21,659 court of law 1594 01:22:28,100 --> 01:22:27,249 but we can to just mock look at the 1595 01:22:29,810 --> 01:22:28,110 evidence 1596 01:22:35,479 --> 01:22:29,820 some interesting articles that came out 1597 01:22:39,350 --> 01:22:35,489 this this week it was designed primarily 1598 01:22:43,100 --> 01:22:39,360 to talk about the elections and 1599 01:22:47,800 --> 01:22:43,110 political things but how you know our 1600 01:22:50,720 --> 01:22:47,810 brains are literally skewed in favor of 1601 01:22:53,320 --> 01:22:50,730 emotion and preconceived ideas over 1602 01:22:56,510 --> 01:22:53,330 accepting facts particularly facts 1603 01:23:02,030 --> 01:22:56,520 radically disagree with the 1604 01:23:04,370 --> 01:23:02,040 preconception what you just said there 1605 01:23:07,040 --> 01:23:04,380 are a minute ago about overwhelming 1606 01:23:10,810 --> 01:23:07,050 evidence do you want to give a couple of 1607 01:23:14,149 --> 01:23:10,820 examples of what you're talking about 1608 01:23:16,640 --> 01:23:14,159 well which phenomena you want you know 1609 01:23:18,740 --> 01:23:16,650 I've been in your death study I think 1610 01:23:23,330 --> 01:23:18,750 continuation of consciousness beyond 1611 01:23:27,620 --> 01:23:23,340 physical death is you know all but but 1612 01:23:31,760 --> 01:23:27,630 proven some of the things that I'm doing 1613 01:23:34,459 --> 01:23:31,770 when I was in Togo and Benin and West 1614 01:23:37,820 --> 01:23:34,469 Africa and saw things and voodoo 1615 01:23:39,350 --> 01:23:37,830 ceremonies that got on videotape that 1616 01:23:41,870 --> 01:23:39,360 I'm not publishing because I've never 1617 01:23:44,540 --> 01:23:41,880 seen anything like it but where guys are 1618 01:23:46,820 --> 01:23:44,550 standing in fire sitting in fire eating 1619 01:23:51,100 --> 01:23:46,830 fire holding it in their mouth and you 1620 01:23:53,689 --> 01:23:51,110 watch it glow as they inhale and exhale 1621 01:23:54,680 --> 01:23:53,699 so it's definitely there for holding it 1622 01:23:58,070 --> 01:23:54,690 there for a minute 1623 01:24:01,820 --> 01:23:58,080 I've had that examined by magicians and 1624 01:24:06,229 --> 01:24:01,830 just said no way you you know there's no 1625 01:24:09,740 --> 01:24:06,239 tricks of involved well I have seen I 1626 01:24:13,010 --> 01:24:09,750 you know we visited shamans all over the 1627 01:24:15,560 --> 01:24:13,020 world seen various kinds of phenomena 1628 01:24:21,520 --> 01:24:15,570 now where are things I point out is that 1629 01:24:24,830 --> 01:24:21,530 I do work in Brazil periodically and 1630 01:24:28,430 --> 01:24:24,840 often in the non-lethal weapons area but 1631 01:24:31,520 --> 01:24:28,440 the point there is that in dealing with 1632 01:24:35,600 --> 01:24:31,530 intelligentsia highly educated Western 1633 01:24:40,550 --> 01:24:35,610 systems their belief system totally 1634 01:24:41,899 --> 01:24:40,560 accommodates the spirit world and can 1635 01:24:45,020 --> 01:24:41,909 integrate that 1636 01:24:47,959 --> 01:24:45,030 a Western education with no problem the 1637 01:24:51,770 --> 01:24:47,969 problem we have in the quote Western 1638 01:24:54,439 --> 01:24:51,780 world is that we consider a spirit world 1639 01:24:57,109 --> 01:24:54,449 in the real world if you even believe in 1640 01:25:01,370 --> 01:24:57,119 the possibility of a spirit world to be 1641 01:25:03,770 --> 01:25:01,380 separate and distinct so there's a 1642 01:25:06,199 --> 01:25:03,780 fundamental problem in our belief 1643 01:25:09,439 --> 01:25:06,209 systems and what evidence were willing 1644 01:25:12,709 --> 01:25:09,449 to accept but I think it's overwhelming 1645 01:25:15,589 --> 01:25:12,719 and in favor now you had some 1646 01:25:19,009 --> 01:25:15,599 involvement somehow with remote viewing 1647 01:25:21,560 --> 01:25:19,019 as well I've certainly been on the 1648 01:25:24,770 --> 01:25:21,570 tangent of that and I was with the hurva 1649 01:25:27,250 --> 01:25:24,780 when it was on their board when it was 1650 01:25:29,919 --> 01:25:27,260 formed so quite familiar with the 1651 01:25:31,549 --> 01:25:29,929 participants and the technology yeah 1652 01:25:35,719 --> 01:25:31,559 uh-huh 1653 01:25:38,060 --> 01:25:35,729 that's that's a fascinating topic of 1654 01:25:40,939 --> 01:25:38,070 course it's way off of the UFO topic for 1655 01:25:43,399 --> 01:25:40,949 me moon I've looked into that a little 1656 01:25:47,299 --> 01:25:43,409 bit you know it's really really 1657 01:25:49,489 --> 01:25:47,309 interesting and yep I you know there are 1658 01:25:53,449 --> 01:25:49,499 a lot of things that are unexplainable 1659 01:25:55,100 --> 01:25:53,459 and that's going to steer us toward your 1660 01:25:59,600 --> 01:25:55,110 involvement with the skinwalker ranch 1661 01:26:01,640 --> 01:25:59,610 I've had a lot of email conversations 1662 01:26:03,620 --> 01:26:01,650 with George Knapp I've never been able 1663 01:26:06,890 --> 01:26:03,630 to get him on the show he's a very busy 1664 01:26:08,299 --> 01:26:06,900 guy I'm sure you know that but let's 1665 01:26:10,729 --> 01:26:08,309 talk about that so you were involved 1666 01:26:14,989 --> 01:26:10,739 with Bob Bigelow and how did it come 1667 01:26:18,080 --> 01:26:14,999 about where you were on this team there 1668 01:26:20,120 --> 01:26:18,090 at the skinwalker ranch well I was about 1669 01:26:25,219 --> 01:26:20,130 the day bought the ranch so I was the 1670 01:26:28,729 --> 01:26:25,229 first one our folks to actively they'll 1671 01:26:32,359 --> 01:26:28,739 stay up there the others you know 1672 01:26:34,640 --> 01:26:32,369 overtime spent a lot more time than I 1673 01:26:38,569 --> 01:26:34,650 did but we would go up and just watch 1674 01:26:41,449 --> 01:26:38,579 I've got to say when the things I 1675 01:26:45,399 --> 01:26:41,459 personally observed there I did not see 1676 01:26:51,290 --> 01:26:45,409 anything that isn't pretty explainable 1677 01:26:53,719 --> 01:26:51,300 personally that said there were a number 1678 01:26:54,790 --> 01:26:53,729 of incidents that happen with you know 1679 01:26:57,540 --> 01:26:54,800 our guys there 1680 01:27:01,270 --> 01:26:57,550 that just again over totally 1681 01:27:03,839 --> 01:27:01,280 overwhelming and absolutely happened and 1682 01:27:07,149 --> 01:27:03,849 so bizarre this is one of the problems 1683 01:27:09,750 --> 01:27:07,159 and in fact again in the book I did 1684 01:27:13,600 --> 01:27:09,760 address that and what I call the 1685 01:27:16,810 --> 01:27:13,610 precognitive sentience phenomena meaning 1686 01:27:19,330 --> 01:27:16,820 that UFOs were a piece of that but only 1687 01:27:23,500 --> 01:27:19,340 a small piece that the phenomena were 1688 01:27:29,200 --> 01:27:23,510 very broad and in considerable depth and 1689 01:27:32,080 --> 01:27:29,210 the point was that we would you know we 1690 01:27:33,669 --> 01:27:32,090 would start studying things and then you 1691 01:27:37,149 --> 01:27:33,679 know an incident would happened 1692 01:27:39,669 --> 01:27:37,159 start to study it and then phenomena 1693 01:27:42,160 --> 01:27:39,679 would go oh you like that try this and 1694 01:27:45,640 --> 01:27:42,170 you would get something totally 1695 01:27:48,669 --> 01:27:45,650 different now white why would you think 1696 01:27:51,280 --> 01:27:48,679 in one spot like that one area like that 1697 01:27:53,049 --> 01:27:51,290 so many things were happening any ideas 1698 01:27:56,950 --> 01:27:53,059 that anyone come try to come up with 1699 01:28:02,290 --> 01:27:56,960 something Oh many many things we had the 1700 01:28:04,959 --> 01:28:02,300 place in instrumented but with all of us 1701 01:28:15,010 --> 01:28:04,969 and we were monitoring that timeless 1702 01:28:17,560 --> 01:28:15,020 photography 24/7 and it was you know one 1703 01:28:20,410 --> 01:28:17,570 of the most phenomenal incidents that 1704 01:28:22,540 --> 01:28:20,420 happened was a case where we had four 1705 01:28:27,910 --> 01:28:22,550 cameras on posts about 20 feet high 1706 01:28:31,390 --> 01:28:27,920 looking to the west and the one of the 1707 01:28:35,260 --> 01:28:31,400 outer cameras suddenly stopped working 1708 01:28:37,780 --> 01:28:35,270 now the way it works is the cameras ECGs 1709 01:28:40,180 --> 01:28:37,790 are you know on top of the post there's 1710 01:28:42,640 --> 01:28:40,190 wires going up you got about half a roll 1711 01:28:46,689 --> 01:28:42,650 of duct tape holding on they got close 1712 01:28:52,530 --> 01:28:46,699 to the ground with PVC fixing it so you 1713 01:28:54,850 --> 01:28:52,540 could it would be protected um and this 1714 01:28:58,049 --> 01:28:54,860 what we know when it stopped recording 1715 01:29:02,589 --> 01:28:58,059 and something had reached up and pulled 1716 01:29:06,399 --> 01:29:02,599 the wires loose from the camera the 1717 01:29:08,540 --> 01:29:06,409 entire duct tape was gone there was a 1718 01:29:12,170 --> 01:29:08,550 boning free but chunk of 1719 01:29:14,840 --> 01:29:12,180 the wire that was totally missing the 1720 01:29:18,910 --> 01:29:14,850 PVC had been pulled loose to you clamps 1721 01:29:22,970 --> 01:29:18,920 holding it were gone what was even more 1722 01:29:26,810 --> 01:29:22,980 interesting was at the time that this 1723 01:29:30,170 --> 01:29:26,820 happened the cattle were kind of 1724 01:29:32,600 --> 01:29:30,180 standing around right near the pole for 1725 01:29:34,970 --> 01:29:32,610 these incidents happen the significance 1726 01:29:38,320 --> 01:29:34,980 of that is that if anybody got near the 1727 01:29:40,730 --> 01:29:38,330 cattle you know they would scatter 1728 01:29:43,970 --> 01:29:40,740 absolutely nothing happened and yet 1729 01:29:46,540 --> 01:29:43,980 nothing shows up on the camera that is 1730 01:29:50,360 --> 01:29:46,550 staring at the one where all this 1731 01:29:52,310 --> 01:29:50,370 mischief occurred Wow now how long was 1732 01:29:55,310 --> 01:29:52,320 it that if that someone physically 1733 01:29:58,220 --> 01:29:55,320 looked at the camera in the pole and 1734 01:30:01,490 --> 01:29:58,230 everything after the incident Oh spent 1735 01:30:06,580 --> 01:30:01,500 lots of time they sent the the set the 1736 01:30:11,630 --> 01:30:06,590 wire out for analysis of what to cut it 1737 01:30:15,400 --> 01:30:11,640 it yeah lots of moss and nothing 1738 01:30:21,260 --> 01:30:15,410 absolutely nothing made sensor and again 1739 01:30:23,390 --> 01:30:21,270 instrumented and you know should have 1740 01:30:26,540 --> 01:30:23,400 been on camera but there's absolutely 1741 01:30:28,580 --> 01:30:26,550 nothing there and that's true this is it 1742 01:30:30,350 --> 01:30:28,590 was from the incidents there were many 1743 01:30:32,110 --> 01:30:30,360 many incidents that happened up at the 1744 01:30:35,890 --> 01:30:32,120 ranch 1745 01:30:39,380 --> 01:30:35,900 and I said it's precognitive in that 1746 01:30:44,210 --> 01:30:39,390 something knows how you are going to 1747 01:30:48,740 --> 01:30:44,220 respond to stimuli and an accident or an 1748 01:30:51,260 --> 01:30:48,750 incident before it even occurs is 1749 01:30:54,500 --> 01:30:51,270 certainly intelligent and certainly 1750 01:30:57,340 --> 01:30:54,510 phenomenal you think do you think of a 1751 01:31:02,240 --> 01:30:57,350 trickster or whatnot um you know 1752 01:31:04,970 --> 01:31:02,250 something was there and it it was 1753 01:31:11,240 --> 01:31:04,980 totally in charge and every time you get 1754 01:31:14,840 --> 01:31:11,250 to working on it um you know it go oh 1755 01:31:16,840 --> 01:31:14,850 you like that try this and you would get 1756 01:31:20,750 --> 01:31:16,850 something totally different 1757 01:31:21,689 --> 01:31:20,760 what up the one thing when I read the 1758 01:31:25,890 --> 01:31:21,699 book 1759 01:31:27,120 --> 01:31:25,900 that really intrigued me was the talk 1760 01:31:29,219 --> 01:31:27,130 about I think there was two or three 1761 01:31:32,989 --> 01:31:29,229 people watching they saw what looked 1762 01:31:36,449 --> 01:31:32,999 like a portal or something and sometimes 1763 01:31:38,969 --> 01:31:36,459 yeah and then the being of whatever it 1764 01:31:42,899 --> 01:31:38,979 was crying all are kind of there you see 1765 01:31:45,779 --> 01:31:42,909 what you see is a Jim white probably 1766 01:31:48,810 --> 01:31:45,789 about three feet above the ground wasn't 1767 01:31:53,189 --> 01:31:48,820 quite there and something the head and 1768 01:31:57,479 --> 01:31:53,199 shoulders popped itself up and you know 1769 01:32:02,370 --> 01:31:57,489 went running off and this was a kind of 1770 01:32:05,759 --> 01:32:02,380 a powdery dirt road and he went down you 1771 01:32:08,009 --> 01:32:05,769 know no footprints so this I think 1772 01:32:11,790 --> 01:32:08,019 definitely came out from somewhere when 1773 01:32:14,969 --> 01:32:11,800 running off it just makes you wonder why 1774 01:32:17,160 --> 01:32:14,979 there's places were all these different 1775 01:32:18,540 --> 01:32:17,170 I mean especially I've never heard of so 1776 01:32:22,830 --> 01:32:18,550 many different things happen in one 1777 01:32:25,739 --> 01:32:22,840 location as a in that place what about 1778 01:32:29,129 --> 01:32:25,749 now what what do we know now what's 1779 01:32:33,209 --> 01:32:29,139 going on there uh I don't know I've not 1780 01:32:35,669 --> 01:32:33,219 been in touch with them they what 1781 01:32:42,540 --> 01:32:35,679 happened eventually was the event sort 1782 01:32:45,419 --> 01:32:42,550 of slowed down and you know Bob got more 1783 01:32:48,359 --> 01:32:45,429 interested in space you know in running 1784 01:32:54,629 --> 01:32:48,369 Bigelow Aerospace and went off in that 1785 01:32:56,640 --> 01:32:54,639 direction right so we had there were 1786 01:32:58,890 --> 01:32:56,650 like you said there were a couple of UFO 1787 01:33:02,640 --> 01:32:58,900 sightings I when I was reading the book 1788 01:33:05,669 --> 01:33:02,650 I remember that there was not talked 1789 01:33:11,239 --> 01:33:05,679 about too many maybe three or four times 1790 01:33:14,850 --> 01:33:11,249 that subject came up tides of 1791 01:33:20,819 --> 01:33:14,860 different like large dogs and animals 1792 01:33:23,580 --> 01:33:20,829 and so I do recommend that book to the 1793 01:33:26,839 --> 01:33:23,590 listener out there it's a hello first 1794 01:33:34,169 --> 01:33:26,849 for the skinwalker yes yeah excellent 1795 01:33:37,410 --> 01:33:34,179 yeah and so what what other things 1796 01:33:39,419 --> 01:33:37,420 were when you were there what was it 1797 01:33:41,009 --> 01:33:39,429 like being there I mean was it a lot of 1798 01:33:44,040 --> 01:33:41,019 sitting around and waiting for something 1799 01:33:48,029 --> 01:33:44,050 to happen well you know I had a shootout 1800 01:33:49,859 --> 01:33:48,039 with Jesse Ventura and yeah I was one of 1801 01:33:53,219 --> 01:33:49,869 the things they said yell can I catch up 1802 01:33:56,189 --> 01:33:53,229 the ranch since it will no said besides 1803 01:33:59,040 --> 01:33:56,199 you be really bored because again we 1804 01:34:01,169 --> 01:33:59,050 talked about we had phenomenal incidents 1805 01:34:05,969 --> 01:34:01,179 occur but when you split that up over 1806 01:34:07,830 --> 01:34:05,979 six years it's not like you know we're 1807 01:34:12,679 --> 01:34:07,840 stop popping every night or anything 1808 01:34:16,410 --> 01:34:12,689 like that so yet periodically these 1809 01:34:18,839 --> 01:34:16,420 phenomenal events did occur uh-huh and 1810 01:34:19,410 --> 01:34:18,849 cattle mutilations here that's how it 1811 01:34:22,290 --> 01:34:19,420 all began 1812 01:34:24,629 --> 01:34:22,300 didn't it or shortly after the family 1813 01:34:27,359 --> 01:34:24,639 that moved there were several cases 1814 01:34:30,810 --> 01:34:27,369 Terry had lots and lots of problems at 1815 01:34:33,479 --> 01:34:30,820 the ranch I mean again I would recommend 1816 01:34:37,020 --> 01:34:33,489 the book because it covers many many of 1817 01:34:41,779 --> 01:34:37,030 the incidents one of the strangest ones 1818 01:34:44,669 --> 01:34:41,789 that happened under our watch was I 1819 01:34:46,589 --> 01:34:44,679 forget the year this is written up in 1820 01:34:52,919 --> 01:34:46,599 the book I think I used it but anyway 1821 01:34:55,679 --> 01:34:52,929 the it was cabbing season and Jerry went 1822 01:34:58,049 --> 01:34:55,689 out found the newborn what they would do 1823 01:35:01,589 --> 01:34:58,059 is tag it and weigh it the tag 1824 01:35:04,589 --> 01:35:01,599 associates it with the mother drove 1825 01:35:10,109 --> 01:35:04,599 across the field and this is just as 1826 01:35:12,330 --> 01:35:10,119 flat as you can imagine totally open you 1827 01:35:16,199 --> 01:35:12,340 know complete line of sight no problem 1828 01:35:18,810 --> 01:35:16,209 there um finds another newborn tags it 1829 01:35:22,549 --> 01:35:18,820 weighs it and he comes back in about 45 1830 01:35:26,009 --> 01:35:22,559 minutes elapsed time and cap one is dead 1831 01:35:30,270 --> 01:35:26,019 not only is it dead has been mutilated 1832 01:35:34,129 --> 01:35:30,280 exsanguinated ears been chopped off the 1833 01:35:36,959 --> 01:35:34,139 femur of this one I think the femur was 1834 01:35:41,939 --> 01:35:36,969 separated from the body but about 20 1835 01:35:43,859 --> 01:35:41,949 pounds of stopped yes excuse me is 1836 01:35:47,100 --> 01:35:43,869 missing Wow 1837 01:35:47,850 --> 01:35:47,110 and like I say it happened in broad 1838 01:35:54,770 --> 01:35:47,860 daylight 1839 01:35:57,450 --> 01:35:54,780 I um 1840 01:35:58,919 --> 01:35:57,460 you know people said well the blood just 1841 01:36:02,970 --> 01:35:58,929 went in the ground 1842 01:36:05,729 --> 01:36:02,980 we had Adam get blood from a butcher job 1843 01:36:07,800 --> 01:36:05,739 pour it on the ground the weeks later 1844 01:36:10,500 --> 01:36:07,810 you'd say no that's for the blood was 1845 01:36:12,780 --> 01:36:10,510 bored on the ground so that did not 1846 01:36:17,189 --> 01:36:12,790 account for all of the things that 1847 01:36:19,140 --> 01:36:17,199 happened the here with the tag on looked 1848 01:36:22,500 --> 01:36:19,150 like it had been almost surgically 1849 01:36:25,109 --> 01:36:22,510 removed very very clean there were knife 1850 01:36:27,300 --> 01:36:25,119 marks on some of the other bones and 1851 01:36:30,870 --> 01:36:27,310 other cuts on there here's one that 1852 01:36:32,729 --> 01:36:30,880 happens like there is the problem with 1853 01:36:34,859 --> 01:36:32,739 most cattle mutilations is you have no 1854 01:36:37,560 --> 01:36:34,869 idea when they occurred you know people 1855 01:36:40,890 --> 01:36:37,570 think that ranchers see their cattle on 1856 01:36:42,600 --> 01:36:40,900 a continuous basis reality is that in 1857 01:36:44,580 --> 01:36:42,610 the summer they'll tell them loosening 1858 01:36:47,430 --> 01:36:44,590 you mean I'll see them for weeks or 1859 01:36:51,540 --> 01:36:47,440 months at a time so you come across a 1860 01:36:53,490 --> 01:36:51,550 dead calf and you don't know when the 1861 01:36:55,770 --> 01:36:53,500 incident occurred or what degree and 1862 01:36:58,560 --> 01:36:55,780 yeah some of that is certainly predation 1863 01:37:02,430 --> 01:36:58,570 but there's other kinds of incidents 1864 01:37:04,649 --> 01:37:02,440 that happen that certainly do not you 1865 01:37:10,160 --> 01:37:04,659 know answer that and this particular one 1866 01:37:14,879 --> 01:37:10,170 was suffocation we had George and that 1867 01:37:16,950 --> 01:37:14,889 was the DVM was on the scene within a 1868 01:37:22,310 --> 01:37:16,960 few hours and be able to do a necropsy 1869 01:37:25,550 --> 01:37:22,320 on it and justifies all reasonable 1870 01:37:28,410 --> 01:37:25,560 explanation one of the strangest 1871 01:37:31,500 --> 01:37:28,420 mutilations I've ever heard about was 1872 01:37:33,419 --> 01:37:31,510 one that happened there as well as the 1873 01:37:35,459 --> 01:37:33,429 one that appeared that it was like 1874 01:37:38,370 --> 01:37:35,469 picked up and dropped headfirst into a 1875 01:37:42,479 --> 01:37:38,380 hole Ethan you familiar with that in the 1876 01:37:43,800 --> 01:37:42,489 books don't remember that yeah well 1877 01:37:49,859 --> 01:37:43,810 there were several that we thought were 1878 01:37:51,810 --> 01:37:49,869 dropped or looked like got effects you 1879 01:37:54,990 --> 01:37:51,820 know the analysis on and we looked at 1880 01:37:57,689 --> 01:37:55,000 what had happened and you know you shoot 1881 01:38:00,839 --> 01:37:57,699 cattle rustler so right you know the 1882 01:38:01,660 --> 01:38:00,849 idea that we looked at all of the you 1883 01:38:03,820 --> 01:38:01,670 know the potential 1884 01:38:09,970 --> 01:38:03,830 big predators and things like that and 1885 01:38:15,550 --> 01:38:09,980 this did not get any known predator but 1886 01:38:19,780 --> 01:38:15,560 it you know the best guess was whatever 1887 01:38:21,580 --> 01:38:19,790 happened to happen someplace else now 1888 01:38:25,990 --> 01:38:21,590 having said that then you've got to have 1889 01:38:27,729 --> 01:38:26,000 a way to pick the calf up here go chop 1890 01:38:30,310 --> 01:38:27,739 it up and all that and come back and 1891 01:38:32,800 --> 01:38:30,320 drop it in so this may be the same 1892 01:38:35,380 --> 01:38:32,810 incident because there were a number of 1893 01:38:38,560 --> 01:38:35,390 strange one but what was unique about 1894 01:38:43,510 --> 01:38:38,570 this is we had an absolute you know time 1895 01:38:47,500 --> 01:38:43,520 hack from beginning to hands on it right 1896 01:38:50,350 --> 01:38:47,510 now whether I like you said about the 1897 01:38:54,300 --> 01:38:50,360 cattle cattle is very important to a 1898 01:38:57,580 --> 01:38:54,310 rancher getting a little bit of feedback 1899 01:39:02,260 --> 01:38:57,590 is your phone on speaker or anything 1900 01:39:05,890 --> 01:39:02,270 like that no for some reason okay sounds 1901 01:39:07,479 --> 01:39:05,900 okay now were there any other animals 1902 01:39:09,640 --> 01:39:07,489 horses or anything any other type of 1903 01:39:11,439 --> 01:39:09,650 mutilations happens all the time yeah 1904 01:39:16,030 --> 01:39:11,449 now there were there were lots of other 1905 01:39:20,110 --> 01:39:16,040 incidents that one the next day what was 1906 01:39:23,169 --> 01:39:20,120 unique about that was that again you had 1907 01:39:26,110 --> 01:39:23,179 a start time in a end time if you will 1908 01:39:29,410 --> 01:39:26,120 in a very short period on a bright sunny 1909 01:39:33,360 --> 01:39:29,420 you know morning ten o'clock in the 1910 01:39:40,240 --> 01:39:33,370 morning hi good visibility nothing 1911 01:39:44,680 --> 01:39:40,250 explains you know the incident yeah yeah 1912 01:39:46,720 --> 01:39:44,690 that's that's always intrigued me and 1913 01:39:50,229 --> 01:39:46,730 whether it has anything to do with UFOs 1914 01:39:51,580 --> 01:39:50,239 you know I mean you hear about every 1915 01:39:53,919 --> 01:39:51,590 once in a while someone will say they 1916 01:39:55,650 --> 01:39:53,929 had a sighting and then you know the 1917 01:39:57,900 --> 01:39:55,660 next day there was a cattle mutilation 1918 01:40:03,459 --> 01:39:57,910 it's just another one of those 1919 01:40:06,640 --> 01:40:03,469 unexplainable but there again this is I 1920 01:40:08,439 --> 01:40:06,650 think one of the big errors that that 1921 01:40:11,260 --> 01:40:08,449 they make and that is establishing 1922 01:40:13,090 --> 01:40:11,270 causal relationship in the incident that 1923 01:40:15,430 --> 01:40:13,100 I just described there's no known 1924 01:40:18,939 --> 01:40:15,440 sighting that occurred I do 1925 01:40:21,459 --> 01:40:18,949 no others and they try to make video the 1926 01:40:29,800 --> 01:40:21,469 relationship and that gets pretty damn 1927 01:40:33,250 --> 01:40:29,810 tenuous now I I watched a long time ago 1928 01:40:36,250 --> 01:40:33,260 Linda Moulton Howes first she did a 1929 01:40:38,050 --> 01:40:36,260 documentary years ago on cattle 1930 01:40:40,270 --> 01:40:38,060 mutilation I thought was pretty decent 1931 01:40:50,950 --> 01:40:40,280 what do you what's your opinion on that 1932 01:40:53,320 --> 01:40:50,960 did you get to watch that yep see it's 1933 01:40:56,290 --> 01:40:53,330 whatever you think it is I mean there 1934 01:40:58,959 --> 01:40:56,300 certainly were some strange things that 1935 01:41:01,750 --> 01:40:58,969 happened and that was in again the early 1936 01:41:06,640 --> 01:41:01,760 days and tool it would appear to be the 1937 01:41:10,120 --> 01:41:06,650 early days of these kinds of occurrences 1938 01:41:11,470 --> 01:41:10,130 so now this is a thing you know people 1939 01:41:14,709 --> 01:41:11,480 always talk about well there's no 1940 01:41:17,890 --> 01:41:14,719 evidence for UFOs or you know the 1941 01:41:19,570 --> 01:41:17,900 skeptics say there's you know UFOs 1942 01:41:21,459 --> 01:41:19,580 aren't important because there's no way 1943 01:41:23,830 --> 01:41:21,469 to get any evidence that they're here 1944 01:41:25,840 --> 01:41:23,840 which some people would argue that not 1945 01:41:27,490 --> 01:41:25,850 true I mean basically every sensor 1946 01:41:29,950 --> 01:41:27,500 system we have pick them up they are 1947 01:41:32,979 --> 01:41:29,960 picked up by satellite but you get 1948 01:41:36,390 --> 01:41:32,989 camera sightings on a continuous basic 1949 01:41:39,790 --> 01:41:36,400 you've got acoustic sensors we've had 1950 01:41:45,270 --> 01:41:39,800 magnetic sensors etc etc you've had you 1951 01:41:47,950 --> 01:41:45,280 know what Bentwaters radiation radar so 1952 01:41:50,800 --> 01:41:47,960 you say there's no evidence what you're 1953 01:41:53,410 --> 01:41:50,810 really saying is I'm not going to take 1954 01:41:56,740 --> 01:41:53,420 the time to look right so the point I 1955 01:41:59,950 --> 01:41:56,750 was making in that statement is that as 1956 01:42:05,709 --> 01:41:59,960 far as that's what a skeptic will say 1957 01:42:07,420 --> 01:42:05,719 well as far as cattle mutilations people 1958 01:42:09,810 --> 01:42:07,430 will say there's no evidence that 1959 01:42:13,900 --> 01:42:09,820 something unusual is going on it's a 1960 01:42:17,650 --> 01:42:13,910 it's a coyote getting the soft tissue or 1961 01:42:20,910 --> 01:42:17,660 whatever this is the classic answer that 1962 01:42:23,830 --> 01:42:20,920 comes up yeah but when I went but 1963 01:42:29,020 --> 01:42:23,840 obviously in cases like I just described 1964 01:42:31,870 --> 01:42:29,030 it was basically you know again happen 1965 01:42:35,040 --> 01:42:31,880 daylight short period of time there's no 1966 01:42:38,830 --> 01:42:35,050 way in hell that was predation right and 1967 01:42:40,750 --> 01:42:38,840 so but the one thing that puzzles me on 1968 01:42:45,700 --> 01:42:40,760 this whole situation of cattle 1969 01:42:49,330 --> 01:42:45,710 mutilations is that nobody has ever seen 1970 01:42:55,000 --> 01:42:49,340 one actually happening you know with 1971 01:42:57,640 --> 01:42:55,010 cameras with it just seems like the 1972 01:43:00,520 --> 01:42:57,650 ranchers would with all the ones that 1973 01:43:03,810 --> 01:43:00,530 have been lost over the years and that's 1974 01:43:07,720 --> 01:43:03,820 not me that's their goal we're back to 1975 01:43:10,240 --> 01:43:07,730 the same issue of you say all the ones 1976 01:43:12,790 --> 01:43:10,250 that have been lost yeah when you put it 1977 01:43:17,470 --> 01:43:12,800 in a single stack someone's like a lot 1978 01:43:20,890 --> 01:43:17,480 when you look at it you know over 50 60 1979 01:43:25,330 --> 01:43:20,900 years they're actually pretty rare 1980 01:43:27,729 --> 01:43:25,340 occurrences one thing about the ranch 1981 01:43:30,819 --> 01:43:27,739 was that they you know a lot of this 1982 01:43:34,510 --> 01:43:30,829 activity did seem to be concentrated in 1983 01:43:38,770 --> 01:43:34,520 that area right it was such a wide 1984 01:43:41,229 --> 01:43:38,780 variety of things and again if I go back 1985 01:43:44,799 --> 01:43:41,239 to remember we had incidents happened 1986 01:43:48,250 --> 01:43:44,809 had it instrumented and it was like 1987 01:43:51,819 --> 01:43:48,260 every time you tried to do something it 1988 01:43:57,520 --> 01:43:51,829 would go yet being this controller 1989 01:44:01,720 --> 01:43:57,530 whatever it is great the great trickster 1990 01:44:06,850 --> 01:44:01,730 if you will it would change it and again 1991 01:44:10,209 --> 01:44:06,860 it would know what you were planning to 1992 01:44:12,970 --> 01:44:10,219 do before you did it and every time I we 1993 01:44:16,330 --> 01:44:12,980 we did a lot of we went to animal 1994 01:44:19,930 --> 01:44:16,340 sensors of pens putting dogs and the 1995 01:44:22,120 --> 01:44:19,940 Pens saying okay let's have you know the 1996 01:44:23,770 --> 01:44:22,130 reason for the Pens was so they we knew 1997 01:44:28,350 --> 01:44:23,780 exactly where they were and how they 1998 01:44:33,779 --> 01:44:28,360 would respond well that didn't work um 1999 01:44:41,529 --> 01:44:33,789 it it whatever it is it is in charge 2000 01:44:42,859 --> 01:44:41,539 well and I believe that the Native 2001 01:44:45,409 --> 01:44:42,869 Americans local native 2002 01:44:48,319 --> 01:44:45,419 Americans were have said that something 2003 01:44:51,770 --> 01:44:48,329 in that area has been happening like 2004 01:44:53,869 --> 01:44:51,780 throughout their ancestry yep yeah 2005 01:44:57,439 --> 01:44:53,879 that's one of the things we did know 2006 01:44:59,750 --> 01:44:57,449 that you know people talk about Terry 2007 01:45:04,069 --> 01:44:59,760 was the guy that bought the ranch from 2008 01:45:09,020 --> 01:45:04,079 but these strange things in the area 2009 01:45:14,779 --> 01:45:09,030 certainly predated everybody that we 2010 01:45:15,500 --> 01:45:14,789 know now was anyone there ever that 2011 01:45:19,540 --> 01:45:15,510 you're aware of 2012 01:45:22,129 --> 01:45:19,550 did you ever feel scared being there no 2013 01:45:23,779 --> 01:45:22,139 so you never felt like anything 2014 01:45:26,899 --> 01:45:23,789 threatening even though something 2015 01:45:29,119 --> 01:45:26,909 unusual was happening all the time not 2016 01:45:32,089 --> 01:45:29,129 all the time but I mean it was one that 2017 01:45:34,310 --> 01:45:32,099 I think they talked about who seemed to 2018 01:45:36,739 --> 01:45:34,320 be more sensitive than the rest of us 2019 01:45:39,290 --> 01:45:36,749 who was aware of the fear would not have 2020 01:45:42,379 --> 01:45:39,300 been one of the descriptions but 2021 01:45:45,290 --> 01:45:42,389 certainly awareness and there was at one 2022 01:45:46,850 --> 01:45:45,300 time it was almost a predator if you're 2023 01:45:49,339 --> 01:45:46,860 going back to the movie like being 2024 01:45:54,229 --> 01:45:49,349 something moving up through the trees 2025 01:45:58,239 --> 01:45:54,239 and Gotha sensing that a mental message 2026 01:46:04,580 --> 01:45:58,249 that says we are watching you Wow and 2027 01:46:09,319 --> 01:46:04,590 but again the incidence while very very 2028 01:46:11,089 --> 01:46:09,329 dramatic were by and large rare it 2029 01:46:12,619 --> 01:46:11,099 wasn't like you could set up and say 2030 01:46:17,799 --> 01:46:12,629 okay we're going to go out Wednesday 2031 01:46:20,989 --> 01:46:17,809 night and have an incident occur yeah 2032 01:46:23,959 --> 01:46:20,999 well they wish we could do that but this 2033 01:46:27,949 --> 01:46:23,969 is where I get back to this you know the 2034 01:46:28,520 --> 01:46:27,959 trickster and whatever it is being in 2035 01:46:32,540 --> 01:46:28,530 charge 2036 01:46:36,500 --> 01:46:32,550 it totally determines what's going to 2037 01:46:38,270 --> 01:46:36,510 happen so in that case when Terry was 2038 01:46:41,899 --> 01:46:38,280 there earlier with the him and his 2039 01:46:44,479 --> 01:46:41,909 family and running the ranch all those 2040 01:46:46,790 --> 01:46:44,489 things were happening when Bob bought 2041 01:46:50,899 --> 01:46:46,800 the place did things slow down 2042 01:46:53,959 --> 01:46:50,909 immediately or was that a gradual they 2043 01:46:56,070 --> 01:46:53,969 would fluctuate some of it seemed to be 2044 01:46:59,200 --> 01:46:56,080 cyclical 2045 01:47:00,160 --> 01:46:59,210 but you know not certainly not 2046 01:47:08,530 --> 01:47:00,170 predictable 2047 01:47:10,120 --> 01:47:08,540 we're ghost-like things I can't remember 2048 01:47:12,420 --> 01:47:10,130 did anything like that happen there as 2049 01:47:17,920 --> 01:47:15,970 ghost like yeah I mean did you nowhere 2050 01:47:19,450 --> 01:47:17,930 was there any ghost sightings in the 2051 01:47:21,130 --> 01:47:19,460 house or I mean there's so many 2052 01:47:23,290 --> 01:47:21,140 different things happened I just 2053 01:47:25,060 --> 01:47:23,300 wondered if that was part of it I can't 2054 01:47:33,550 --> 01:47:25,070 I can't remember I read the book quite a 2055 01:47:35,530 --> 01:47:33,560 quite a while ago yeah um I guess you'd 2056 01:47:39,580 --> 01:47:35,540 have to go back and say what do you mean 2057 01:47:42,370 --> 01:47:39,590 by ghosts and we may be moving to a hold 2058 01:47:46,470 --> 01:47:42,380 of you know phenomena here but there 2059 01:47:50,500 --> 01:47:46,480 were certainly things that happens that 2060 01:47:54,850 --> 01:47:50,510 have no correlation and physical reality 2061 01:47:57,430 --> 01:47:54,860 as we know it yeah all right well let's 2062 01:48:01,390 --> 01:47:57,440 just say were the wizard are we aware of 2063 01:48:03,130 --> 01:48:01,400 any poltergeist type of situations where 2064 01:48:05,979 --> 01:48:03,140 things were moved or anything like that 2065 01:48:09,820 --> 01:48:05,989 Oh Terry describes that happening 2066 01:48:12,670 --> 01:48:09,830 continuously yes okay I just put stuff 2067 01:48:15,310 --> 01:48:12,680 down and you know you go to get 2068 01:48:18,910 --> 01:48:15,320 something and you find the shovel up in 2069 01:48:21,040 --> 01:48:18,920 the tree or you know gloves moves and 2070 01:48:24,370 --> 01:48:21,050 things like that because then you serve 2071 01:48:26,229 --> 01:48:24,380 a woman's word I put it because it's not 2072 01:48:29,800 --> 01:48:26,239 like you were laying things out and 2073 01:48:36,510 --> 01:48:29,810 saying I'm going to expecting something 2074 01:48:39,939 --> 01:48:36,520 weird to happen but it did happen yeah 2075 01:48:43,660 --> 01:48:39,949 we got about six or eight minutes 2076 01:48:45,250 --> 01:48:43,670 something like that left and so if 2077 01:48:48,040 --> 01:48:45,260 you're in the message board you're 2078 01:48:50,920 --> 01:48:48,050 welcome to pose a question one of the 2079 01:48:54,310 --> 01:48:50,930 things I wanted to jump back to the UFO 2080 01:48:59,459 --> 01:48:54,320 topic it looks like about about seven 2081 01:49:03,939 --> 01:48:59,469 minutes or so I wanted if you would to 2082 01:49:05,979 --> 01:49:03,949 tell us what you think about you 2083 01:49:09,510 --> 01:49:05,989 mentioned crafts up to a mile long that 2084 01:49:13,110 --> 01:49:09,520 makes me think of the Phoenix lights so 2085 01:49:16,350 --> 01:49:13,120 mantastic case I know them so you had 2086 01:49:18,510 --> 01:49:16,360 her on oh yeah this is one where you 2087 01:49:21,420 --> 01:49:18,520 have thousands of witnesses and the 2088 01:49:25,730 --> 01:49:21,430 courts little problems is that it wasn't 2089 01:49:28,800 --> 01:49:25,740 Phoenix you know the incident started 2090 01:49:31,520 --> 01:49:28,810 here close where I am in Henderson 2091 01:49:36,750 --> 01:49:31,530 Nevada and you have a time-synchronized 2092 01:49:40,970 --> 01:49:36,760 down over the Kingman Arizona Prescott 2093 01:49:47,690 --> 01:49:40,980 over Phoenix and all the way down to 2094 01:49:49,800 --> 01:49:47,700 Tucson possibly coming back again 2095 01:49:53,580 --> 01:49:49,810 thousand literally thousands of 2096 01:49:56,340 --> 01:49:53,590 witnesses and another aspect folks think 2097 01:49:59,340 --> 01:49:56,350 of this as a single incident and what 2098 01:50:02,340 --> 01:49:59,350 lynn says is no this this stuff happened 2099 01:50:06,720 --> 01:50:02,350 periodically not nearly as dramatically 2100 01:50:10,890 --> 01:50:06,730 as you know the lights and all of that 2101 01:50:13,110 --> 01:50:10,900 but she's certainly taken photos it was 2102 01:50:17,250 --> 01:50:13,120 high up enough that actually looked down 2103 01:50:19,890 --> 01:50:17,260 on strange things flying in the area so 2104 01:50:26,280 --> 01:50:19,900 certainly not us again not a singular 2105 01:50:29,160 --> 01:50:26,290 incident right yes the thing that 2106 01:50:31,830 --> 01:50:29,170 intrigues me about that is Fife 2107 01:50:32,910 --> 01:50:31,840 Symington you know that's one of the one 2108 01:50:35,250 --> 01:50:32,920 of the ones that actually he actually 2109 01:50:40,260 --> 01:50:35,260 comes forward and says he saw that in 2110 01:50:42,150 --> 01:50:40,270 the park was that the one thing that I'm 2111 01:50:45,240 --> 01:50:42,160 a little confused on was at the same 2112 01:50:47,190 --> 01:50:45,250 night that everyone thought that Fife 2113 01:50:50,930 --> 01:50:47,200 Symington went to the park and saw it 2114 01:50:56,550 --> 01:50:50,940 gee are you familiar with it which know 2115 01:50:59,240 --> 01:50:56,560 the governor Symington well Symington 2116 01:51:01,440 --> 01:50:59,250 said they saw I think what he did was 2117 01:51:03,210 --> 01:51:01,450 absolutely atrocious 2118 01:51:06,720 --> 01:51:03,220 I mean you know when he had his press 2119 01:51:09,500 --> 01:51:06,730 conference and have the aide come in or 2120 01:51:13,410 --> 01:51:09,510 keep staff dressed up as a big alien 2121 01:51:20,580 --> 01:51:13,420 hahaha isn't his play when he himself 2122 01:51:21,750 --> 01:51:20,590 had actually seen the whatever was the 2123 01:51:24,870 --> 01:51:21,760 phenomena so 2124 01:51:27,000 --> 01:51:24,880 that's where you get the vast number of 2125 01:51:30,470 --> 01:51:27,010 witnesses and I think it's a classic 2126 01:51:33,359 --> 01:51:30,480 example of how not to treat these things 2127 01:51:37,319 --> 01:51:33,369 we haven't gotten the hoaxes but I think 2128 01:51:40,379 --> 01:51:37,329 hoaxes are significant in that they are 2129 01:51:42,209 --> 01:51:40,389 you know they're treated as if harmless 2130 01:51:45,149 --> 01:51:42,219 diversions and I think that's absolutely 2131 01:51:47,609 --> 01:51:45,159 not true I think that they really do a 2132 01:51:49,290 --> 01:51:47,619 great disservice and particularly to 2133 01:51:51,979 --> 01:51:49,300 folks who are trying to figure out what 2134 01:51:58,589 --> 01:51:51,989 the hell the real phenomena are right 2135 01:52:02,459 --> 01:51:58,599 yeah YouTube is full of you know today 2136 01:52:05,459 --> 01:52:02,469 with the CGI technology and there's a 2137 01:52:08,490 --> 01:52:05,469 couple of channels that are there 2138 01:52:10,410 --> 01:52:08,500 they're just looking for lots of views 2139 01:52:15,319 --> 01:52:10,420 could because they make you know money 2140 01:52:18,259 --> 01:52:15,329 per month that are putting out some some 2141 01:52:21,479 --> 01:52:18,269 video so that's all part of hoaxing 2142 01:52:23,910 --> 01:52:21,489 hoaxing has been around whatever the 2143 01:52:27,509 --> 01:52:23,920 subject is forever it's unfortunate it's 2144 01:52:29,850 --> 01:52:27,519 all part of our society and really the 2145 01:52:35,640 --> 01:52:29,860 only thing we can do about it is just be 2146 01:52:38,819 --> 01:52:35,650 aware of it really yeah but like I say 2147 01:52:41,399 --> 01:52:38,829 the hoaxers see themselves as benign and 2148 01:52:45,689 --> 01:52:41,409 I don't I think they're really 2149 01:52:49,350 --> 01:52:45,699 detrimental to the whole process I I do 2150 01:52:52,080 --> 01:52:49,360 too it's I'm in the fine arts and 2151 01:52:55,919 --> 01:52:52,090 antiques and I feel the same way about 2152 01:52:58,229 --> 01:52:55,929 things that are faked and you know 2153 01:53:00,990 --> 01:52:58,239 people that will fake documents or fake 2154 01:53:01,649 --> 01:53:01,000 paintings they'll fake anything that's 2155 01:53:04,470 --> 01:53:01,659 worth money 2156 01:53:07,830 --> 01:53:04,480 they will fake and even if it's a five 2157 01:53:13,319 --> 01:53:07,840 dollar vietnam vietnamese army patch 2158 01:53:16,200 --> 01:53:13,329 they'll fake that anything so we really 2159 01:53:18,660 --> 01:53:16,210 don't have too much time left i would 2160 01:53:23,370 --> 01:53:18,670 love to talk more about hoaxes up what 2161 01:53:27,089 --> 01:53:23,380 do you think just to wrap this up is in 2162 01:53:32,580 --> 01:53:27,099 your opinion the hoax that really got 2163 01:53:35,190 --> 01:53:32,590 under your skin is there any in 2164 01:53:38,310 --> 01:53:35,200 particular or just hoaxes in general 2165 01:53:41,580 --> 01:53:38,320 oh well I would put in general there was 2166 01:53:45,150 --> 01:53:41,590 a classic one I think it was New Jersey 2167 01:53:47,970 --> 01:53:45,160 where they were using balloons and 2168 01:53:50,430 --> 01:53:47,980 putting lanterns in them and sending it 2169 01:53:53,430 --> 01:53:50,440 aloft to have people report UFOs 2170 01:53:56,490 --> 01:53:53,440 you know phenomenally dangerous to begin 2171 01:53:58,560 --> 01:53:56,500 with because those things fall down and 2172 01:54:00,810 --> 01:53:58,570 the flares may not go out starting fires 2173 01:54:05,010 --> 01:54:00,820 and whatnot and what was most 2174 01:54:07,500 --> 01:54:05,020 disconcerting is that you had you know 2175 01:54:10,050 --> 01:54:07,510 fairly legitimate you know in the 2176 01:54:12,120 --> 01:54:10,060 skeptical agencies if you will saying 2177 01:54:14,940 --> 01:54:12,130 you know isn't this wonderful that you 2178 01:54:18,120 --> 01:54:14,950 know they have proven how skeptic or how 2179 01:54:22,680 --> 01:54:18,130 gullible you know people were said no it 2180 01:54:24,780 --> 01:54:22,690 was just quite as dangerous yeah well 2181 01:54:26,820 --> 01:54:24,790 it's kind of like the Chinese lanterns 2182 01:54:29,490 --> 01:54:26,830 that was a little more elaborate but to 2183 01:54:30,770 --> 01:54:29,500 the Chinese lanterns I think I consider 2184 01:54:33,330 --> 01:54:30,780 them dangerous I mean 2185 01:54:35,430 --> 01:54:33,340 I understand how they work they have to 2186 01:54:37,380 --> 01:54:35,440 cool down which means the candles 2187 01:54:39,480 --> 01:54:37,390 supposed to go out before they drop but 2188 01:54:44,250 --> 01:54:39,490 still they just in general they can 2189 01:54:46,290 --> 01:54:44,260 catch on fire and remember if you go 2190 01:54:49,950 --> 01:54:46,300 back to World War two there was actually 2191 01:54:53,040 --> 01:54:49,960 a plot by the Japanese to firebomb the 2192 01:54:55,680 --> 01:54:53,050 Northwest using similar technology that 2193 01:54:58,770 --> 01:54:55,690 we're going to send balloons over and 2194 01:55:01,350 --> 01:54:58,780 with flares and have them burn the 2195 01:55:04,590 --> 01:55:01,360 Northwest kind of a harebrained scheme 2196 01:55:07,170 --> 01:55:04,600 but nonetheless was seriously thought 2197 01:55:09,840 --> 01:55:07,180 about oh I think I think I did hear 2198 01:55:12,240 --> 01:55:09,850 about that John so we're getting ready 2199 01:55:15,150 --> 01:55:12,250 to close here can you give out you you 2200 01:55:16,710 --> 01:55:15,160 do have a website correct and why don't 2201 01:55:19,500 --> 01:55:16,720 you give out that web address 2202 01:55:22,320 --> 01:55:19,510 well easiest thing to do was just google 2203 01:55:25,970 --> 01:55:22,330 my name rather than the website John D 2204 01:55:29,280 --> 01:55:25,980 Alexander middle initial D boy and 2205 01:55:30,930 --> 01:55:29,290 Google will take you right to it and we 2206 01:55:32,010 --> 01:55:30,940 didn't even talk about the title of your 2207 01:55:34,800 --> 01:55:32,020 book 2208 01:55:38,010 --> 01:55:34,810 it's that came out a few years ago it's 2209 01:55:41,280 --> 01:55:38,020 on Amazon with conspiracies and 2210 01:55:43,530 --> 01:55:41,290 realities yeah I like the title that's 2211 01:55:45,660 --> 01:55:43,540 good all right John well thanks so much 2212 01:55:48,340 --> 01:55:45,670 it was a it was a pleasure talking to 2213 01:55:52,210 --> 01:55:48,350 you okay check it out 2214 01:55:55,210 --> 01:55:52,220 right so that's it everyone I appreciate 2215 01:55:56,950 --> 01:55:55,220 you listening this evening and if you're 2216 01:55:59,560 --> 01:55:56,960 a supporter and you're listening to this 2217 01:56:03,130 --> 01:55:59,570 I appreciate that as well if you're 2218 01:56:06,280 --> 01:56:03,140 listening live you want to go to our 2219 01:56:08,680 --> 01:56:06,290 website podcast UFO comm and you'll see 2220 01:56:11,800 --> 01:56:08,690 the support the show button and go down 2221 01:56:15,820 --> 01:56:11,810 and to the sign-in I think it's Ron 2222 01:56:17,920 --> 01:56:15,830 Felber we have on next week he as a 2223 01:56:21,220 --> 01:56:17,930 scientist and he's going to be talking 2224 01:56:23,980 --> 01:56:21,230 about and encounter a couple that had an 2225 01:56:26,620 --> 01:56:23,990 encounter years ago he's really done 2226 01:56:31,210 --> 01:56:26,630 in-depth research is also an author of a 2227 01:56:32,500 --> 01:56:31,220 book and so that will be next week I 2228 01:56:34,390 --> 01:56:32,510 want to thank some people for helping 2229 01:56:36,130 --> 01:56:34,400 out with the show Keith Roland for 2230 01:56:38,320 --> 01:56:36,140 helping us with the live part of the 2231 01:56:41,770 --> 01:56:38,330 show and I want to thank Michael luck 2232 01:56:44,470 --> 01:56:41,780 for taking over the show last week he 2233 01:56:46,000 --> 01:56:44,480 did a wonderful job I think we're out of 2234 01:56:49,960 --> 01:56:46,010 time and we're going to have to go to 2235 01:56:51,580 --> 01:56:49,970 music so thanks everyone and Peggy's 2236 01:56:54,310 --> 01:56:51,590 helping out with the Facebook page and